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Capital vs LaborFinally,straight talk from someone who knows

" Two cheers for Bill Gross, the co-founder and managing director of
PIMCO, the California-based bond house that manages some $2 trillion in
other people's wealth. Gross himself has accumulated $2.2 billion, which
puts him at #252 on the Forbes 400.

"Having gotten rich at the expense of labor," Gross confessed, "the guilt sets in and I begin to feel sorry for the less well-off." The message is addressed to fellow rich guys who are IMCO clients, in
Gross's latest monthly Investment Outlook. He calls them "Scrooge
McDucks." He suggests they stop whining about the enormous taxes they
pay the government and give more back to the society they degraded with

"Admit that you and I and others in the 'magnificent 1 %' grew up in
the gilded age of credit," Gross wrote. "...You did not create that wave.
You rode it. And now it's time to kick out and share some of your good
fortune by paying higher taxes or reforming them to favor economic
growth and labor, as opposed to corporate profits and individual

"The era of taxing 'capital' at lower rates than 'labor' should now end."

"Some other wealthy capitalists like Warren Buffett have made similar
raise-my-taxes pleas, but Bill Gross's is distinctive because, first, he
acknowledges a personal sense of guilt and, second, he bluntly
describes the fundamental conflict as capital versus labor. You seldom
hear that kind of talk any longer in American politics and certainly not
from financial-market billionaires. Gross is not a closet commie. He is
simply acknowledging in plain English the underlying ideological
contest that has dominated the last thirty years.

"Capital won and labor lost. Not just union workers but middle-class
people of all kinds, especially "those who used their hands for a
living," as Gross puts it. That verdict is now so obvious that even
timid commentators talk about it obliquely. The middle class is breaking
up, while the largest capital owners continue to claim an ever larger
share of the nation's wealth, even during the economy's bad years. This
trend has been obvious to working people for years while elite opinion
was celebrating the triumph of market economics. Neither political party
wishes to inquire too deeply into the causes since both Republicans and
Democrats are implicated.

"He cited Barack Obama's recent speech sounding "a faint alarm" about the
failure of corporations and capitalists to invest in US productivity.
Obama said, "It's time for folks to...focus on doing everything we can to
spur growth and create new, high-quality jobs." Gross was exasperated.
"Folks?" he responded. "Ordinary folks, the 99 percent, don't have money
any more. Mr. President. The rich and corporations do."

Okay, I grant you that I'm pushing the fair usage boundary again, but the article was so completely on-point, so much a statement which is long past due, and also illustrates just how mealy-mouthed and conservative a politician Barack Obama really is. A billionaire thinks he's being too accommodating to the right.

It also illustrates just how incredibly muzzled both the centre and left have been by the perpetual Right Wing Noise Machine spreading lies and disinformation which isn't new, It has been around for decades, I read it in old magazines from the 50's at the cottage during the 60's. But it has gotten an awful lot louder since Ronnie Ray-gun made his appearance, telling his tales of fantasy and blaming the vast majority of the people in the Untied States for its own troubles, not the unequal taxation system and the Congress and Senate who are sold to the highest bidder.

(I make that spelling mistake frequently when I'm typing, The more I make it, the more appropriate it looks to me. What was once United is now more and more Untied and the reason for that isn't the state of the 99%, It's the power of the 1% and Corporations who have been waging war on the mass of Americans since the day FDR died.)

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the average worker

In reply to: Capital vs LaborFinally,straight talk from someone who knows

in the US today, pays a lower tax overall after all deductions, than the flat tax levied upon capital gains.

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(NT) first time I've heard that claim

In reply to: the average worker

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(NT) Thx, interesting,

In reply to: Look here

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so if income tax on "typical family of 4"

In reply to: Look here

is the lowest it's been percentage of income wise since 1967, why are some still screaming about needing more tax cuts? no matter what suffers?

though I've never paid that low, of course I've never had a family of 4.

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Perhaps it's the difference of who should make

In reply to: so if income tax on "typical family of 4"

the spending decisions. Excess income can be saved for later, spent on our wants, or sent to the various layers of government. We know what they do with it and some of it isn't to everyone's liking. I'm sure there are plenty of folks out there who'd be happy as clams to have no personal responsibilities and let the government educate them, put them to work, pay for their food and housing and provide them with income when they retire. Unfortunately, an economy can only carry a limited number of such people as the real providers are those who take the initiative to remain as self reliant as is possible. These people are probably the ones who complain most about tax increases.

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