Thank you for being a valued part of the CNET community. As of December 1, 2020, the forums are in read-only format. In early 2021, CNET Forums will no longer be available. We are grateful for the participation and advice you have provided to one another over the years.

Thanks,

CNET Support

General discussion

Cannot check Firmware level and cannot select "captions"

Dec 2, 2008 1:51AM PST

I have a LN52A650 and have a couple of problems with it. In another thread, there was a method described to display the Firmware level by selecting "Help" from the "Setup" menu. I have no "Help" function on my setup menu or any other menus. How can I display the Firmware level?

Another problem. I cannot select "Caption" from the Setup menu either. It is not highlighted and while scrolling through the menu items, it skips over caption.

I have a Sony BDP-301S Blu ray player and there is no Caption available on it that I can find. If a DVD has "Subtitles" I have no problem, but if it only has "CC", the captions will not appear regardless of any setting changes I make. As you might have guessed, I am hard of hearing and need the Captions or Subtitles.

I am going to get a Samsung BD2500 in a month or so and am wondering if I will be able to select Captions from that.

Thanks for any input.

Discussion is locked

- Collapse -
Two questions, two answers.
Dec 4, 2008 7:49AM PST

Hi Dondunlap13,

Welcome to the forum.

To answer your first question, you can check the firmware version by going to:

Setup > Function Help > On

The firmware version will be on the bottom screen next to the question mark. Here is a picture of what you should expect:

http://i397.photobucket.com/albums/pp60/samsung_hd_tech/FirmwareCheck.jpg

Closed captioning:

I can sympathize with your situation, and I have a solution. Most DVDs and Blu-Rays have captioning that is processed as part of the picture as it is sent out to the television.

DVD + Caption THEN outputted to TV usually works.
DVD THEN outputted to TV + caption usually does not. At least this seems to be the status quo in my experience with ANY television.

The best suggestion I can make is to go to the caption menu after the DVD or Blu-Ray loads (often hidden in the "Language" options of the movie's menu) and enable subtitles there. While the DVD or Blu-Ray's hardware for Closed-Captioning menu is on in the player, it may not be receiving that CC info until you tell the disc to play it like that.

Now if you get TWO instances of closed captioning (one on top of the other) you may have to turn off CC in the television and just let the DVD/Blu-Ray player output the CC for that input.

Keep me posted!

--HDTech

- Collapse -
NO Function HELP on setup menu
Dec 4, 2008 8:26AM PST

As I mentioned in my first post, there is NO function Help in my setup menu!! I have selected the setup menu many times and I am not blind, so I would have seen it. There is no HELP function anywhere in any menu. I am at a loss. Why would my TV not have this function??

There is a difference between 'Closed Caption' and 'Subtitles'. As I said, I have NO problems with Subtitles. If a DVD says it has subtitles, I can display them with the proper selections on the DVD menus. My problem is with Closed Caption, which is different. There is an option of 'Caption' under the Setup Menu. It is not highlighted as are the other selectable functions. I cannot select it.
The User Manual for the TV has a paragraph under "Viewing Close Captions (On-Screen Text Messages) - Digital. It says:

"Digital Caption Options are available only when "Default" and Service 1-Service 6 can be selected in 'Caption Mode'.

Where is the "Caption Mode".

I don't have any idea what this statement means! Can you clarify it?

Thanks for any help.

- Collapse -
I can help.
Dec 4, 2008 6:54PM PST

Dondunlap13,

I apologize, I think I got ahead of myself. The feature is in the Setup menu, however, you have to scroll down to the second screen to see it. Keep hitting the down button, and when you get to the bottom of your options, keep hitting the down button and a new screen will appear with Function Help.

With regards to captioning, it is not available on the television using HDMI, Component or PC inputs. Captioning for those inputs must be done at the source, like the cable/sat box or DVD player. The caption menu WILL appear on the television if you use RF, S-video, composite. The signal at this point can't be transferred digitally to the television. That's not just Samsung, that's everybody.

Digital tuners (sat/cable boxes also) are required to have captioning, while HDMI, some component and PC inputs simply can't transmit the CC signal (which is why those sources are required to have it).

The Consumer Electronics Association issued a statement about this, and you can read it here. Essentially, CC signals can't be sent digitally - only through analog, and some analog at that.

http://ce.org/PDF/CEA_Closed_Caption_FAQs_April_2007.pdf

I hate to break the news, but it's not specific to us. The entire industry has very few answers at this point.

--HDTech

- Collapse -
HELP not there
Dec 4, 2008 7:44PM PST

We must be talking apples and oranges. I better qualify - my tv is a SAMSUNG LN52A650 R. The Setup menu contains the following:

Plug & Play
Language
Time
Network Selection (Not Selectable) (Dim light - unhighlighted)
Cable Network Setup
Wireless Network Setup (Not Selectable)
V-Chip (Not Selectable)
Caption (Not Selectable)
Extended Settings
Entertainment
PIP
SW Upgrade.

There is no HELP Function. I can scroll through the options time after time and there is no "second" page. Only those options listed above appear. There is no HELP Function. I can see no HELP function. The HELP function is missing. Why would this be the case on my SAMSUNG LN52A650 R, and be available on yours. There is no mention of a HELP function in my Users Manual.

I think that I understand the Captioning problem. I am thinking about buying a Samsung DBP 2500 next month and am wondering io there is the possibility that it might work with the Samsung TV and display Closed Captions? It sounds as if that is possible but that the manufacturers are not interested in implementing the feature when using a DVD.

Thanks again for your help and I guess I will give up trying to display the Firmware level. It doesn't seem possible on my 'UNIQUE' Samsung.

- Collapse -
Dish Network connection
Dec 4, 2008 7:56PM PST

I didn't mention it before but I am using Dish Network for my input. I have HDMI connections for the Dish Set Top Box and for the DVD. You said:

Digital tuners (sat/cable boxes also) are required to have captioning, while HDMI, some component and PC inputs simply can't transmit the CC signal (which is why those sources are required to have it).

Are you saying that the HDMI CAN'T or just hasn't made the effort to pass the CC signal to the TV? I don't understand the word CAN'T in relation to todays capabilities. It is just more digital data along the interface and if the software is there at both ends to encode and decode it, it can be made to work relatively easy. I have been in the software business for 42 years and know a little bit about it.

Thanks again for your help and I guess that I just need a megaphone to stick in my ear to listen to DVD's that have CC but no subtitles.

- Collapse -
Cannot check Firmware level and cannot select "captions"
Dec 5, 2008 2:45AM PST

Hi
I have a LN40A750. I contacted Samsung to ask the same question and they said it was not possible. Yesterday I found a link on the net and it worked for me.
Using your remote - scroll down to and click on SW Upgrade, then click on the info button on your remote. It should show the rev level.
Hope this works for you.

- Collapse -
Thanks Blackfox
Dec 5, 2008 3:25AM PST

Blackfox, that is the first time that I was able to get it. Thank you very much. I'm not sure why the Samsung rep was having the problem. I don't know if he is reading from some manual or trying things on a TV, but your way worked.

Thanks for your help!

- Collapse -
Nice job!
Dec 5, 2008 5:50AM PST

Thanks Blackfox.

I admit it, I was stumped. I'm guessing that the function help menu option was added on with a newer version of the Firmware, though models shipping today have that firmware built in. Anyway, I can't make excuses; you learn something every day.

As far as the closed captioning, the way I read it from the CEA announcement and my understanding is this: It's not that we're electing to not support CC functionality, it's that CC functionality is by design analog, and can't be transmitted digitally from source to panel. Samsung can't singlehandedly change an industry standard that doesn't exist, but we can work with what is possible, and do! We do offer CC capabilities with what CAN be transmitted; unfortunately, those solutions don't necessarily translate into high definition.

That said, there are no government mandates that CC (or subtitles for that matter) are obligatory on DVDs or Blu-Ray discs either, and I'll have to look into whether or not Blu-Ray players transmitting with HDMI will be able to do CC; my initial guess based on this is no. However, it WILL support subtitles. The only obligations that I can safely deduct is that cable/sat boxes are required to have CC capabilities to send AS PART OF the digital picture to the TV, and analog signals which ends in Feb 2009.

If you opt to not have a cable box, I'm not sure how digital cable is going to do this. Anyone know?

I don't like the sound of these limitations either, but we offer the ability where it is technologically possible, as does our competition. And I also believe in being upfront about it.

Hope that helps.

--HDTech

- Collapse -
Dish...
Dec 5, 2008 5:51AM PST

I almost forgot.

You should be able to enable CC on your Dish Netowrk box in lieu of using the CC feature on the television. It will essentially produce the same result.

--HDTech

- Collapse -
CC on Satellite box
Dec 5, 2008 7:34AM PST

HD tech.

I do that already. When watching programs through the Dish Satellite, I have CC enabled on the box and have no problems with that. The only problem I have is with DVD's. It only affects people like me with a hearing problem, and just restricts us as to which DVD's we can watch. I get most of mine from Netflix and surprisingly, about 75 percent have Subtitles, which I have no problem with. Those that have CC and no Subtitles, I'll just have to bypass.

Thanks for the help to both of you.