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General discussion

Cannon ZR500 audio Input

Dec 4, 2010 3:28AM PST

I'm a theatre teacher, and I just recorded a show at my school. I listened to the video and was saddened by the overwhelming volume of the ambient noise. I want to know if It's possible to record onto my video camera from my mixer. I tried this once with a different mixer, and had an awful result, and have not had the opportunity to figure it out.
Any suggestions?

Discussion is locked

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We can't see what you see or hear what
Dec 4, 2010 1:33PM PST

you can - so... a few questions and possibly some assumptions you can correct.

1) The camcorder was placed at the back of the theater. This means the built-in mics re back there, too. This was needed because if the camcorder were closer, that would block the view of the audience... so...

2) Since the camcorder has a mic jack - which is how you connected the mixer to the camcorder - that got some mics on stage closer to the audio but something else happened that caused and "awful result".

3) Can you describe what "awful result" sounds like?

4) Is connecting the mixer to the camcorder possible to record "better" audio? Maybe. We need to know what mixer (manufacturer and model) and which connections (XLR, 1/4", something else?) were used. If possible start at the mics and work back to their connection to the board, then from the board to the camcorder.

Was the connection from the mixing board using the Mains out, monitor, headphone, line-out or some other "discrete" monitor channel?

5) Which mics (manufacturer and model if possible) were used, how many, where are the mics placed relative to the stage or the actors, how many actors there are, is anyone actively working the board during the show (or are all the audio levels "set/forget")?

6) Had you tried this before - perhaps during rehearsal? Outside of this activity, what sort of use does the camcorder get? How successful are those video capture projects?

7) What is your expectation on the quality of the "project"?

There will be more - depending on your responses.

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RE: can't hear... etc.
Jan 4, 2011 9:26AM PST

Boya84: I will jump between the past and current as I answer your questions... sorry for any whiplash:

1)past: no... the stage was a Cafetorium, with an aisle where the mixing equipment was. The camera was roughly 20 feet from the stage: however The mics would have killed the ambient noise of the audience
Current: Yes, due to length of longest cable, it will either need to be in the back of the house, or onstage plugged into one of the monitor outs

2) yes

3) the audio sounded muffled, not quiet like mixer output is too low, but like audio is recording through insulation (pillow, underwater, IDK) no, a similar distortion was NOT coming through house speakers

4) 'Better' maybe... less ambient white noise & crowd - definitely.
PAST: mixer was a yamaha Probably a MG102c, but I bought it 4 years ago, and left it at the school when I moved 3 years ago.
Current... (tricky) I can't remember brand or model (I didn't buy it) but I would be running Crown perimeter mics or Sennheiser through the system. I have several outs that are not currently in use. after the board I will need to use an output to go to the 1/8" jack of the camera... I will (obviously) need to get more information for you on this.
-question (I'm too tired to think/too lazy to look up) is the camera's mic input mono, or stereo... the 'old' attempt included a stereo RCA cable to stereo 1/8" phone jack and not a mono.

5) Old: honestly, I can't think how I can solve that problem.
Current: mics are as mentioned above. I typically use Crown PCC-160 border mics, but also have random collection of older border mics from AKG, and unknown knock-offs. My Lavs are Sennheiser ew 100 series. I have 6 there, but I also have 5 older (fixed frequency - don't worry all are within the new UHF regs) SHURE brand lavs... The Lavs obviously depend on where the actors are. Typically have no issue getting them to the board (except one I need to troubleshoot, but that should be in a different posting) The perimeter mics are usually about 1/2 foot from the lip. I set one center then 2 others at 1/3 the distance. Our Proscenium is about 40 feet, so there are some gaps, but the actors (usually) do well enough with their projection... It's really to combat the hellish A/C we have that I even set the mics up.

6) no, I keep forgetting my camera at home until the night of (Be Prepared, that's me) Beyond this, the camera gets used for home movies (not caring for the sound quality) The Quality is awesome. It's definitely accurate on its promise of Hi-Def resolution even in less than ideal lighting, but the audio issue could be improved.
I have thought of using a digital audio recorder that we have and dubbing the audio track ofter the fact, but I'm worried about recording differences in speed from the tape to the CD.

7)hopefully, I've covered that, but If I can get an audio that is relatively clear of white noise from A/C and crowd shifting, that would be awesome.

Thanks for your help.

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The "awful audio"...
Jan 5, 2011 7:21AM PST

Resolving item 3 looks like the place to start. Since the mics you list are adequate and the audio coming from the PA main speakers is OK, then there is something going on in the camcorder, the connections between the camcorder and the board or the board itself.

Phase 1: Test 1: Record, in your home, using the camcorder and no external audio connection. This will use the camcorder's built-in mics, but should determine if the camcorder's audio recording subsystem is OK.

Phase 1, Test 2: Record, in your home, using the camcorder and external mic - one of the Sennheiser lavs will work - wired is fine. This will use the camcorder's mic jack, and should determine if the camcorder's audio-in jack recording subsystem is OK.

I think your item 6 response has both of these covered already - I just want to be sure.

If these pass, what is the connection from the mixing board to the camcorder? Specifically, which output on the board, and which cable?

That you are getting any audio at all (muffled) means there is a connection between the board and the camcorder. A short in that cable would produce a different result. It could be something as simple as the mixing board connection sending a line level out to the camcorder that wants a mic-level in...

Then, as I read your #7, I am confused. Is hiss ("white noise") being recorded or is the recorded audio muffled.

And a bit of clarification: The Canon ZR500 (actually the whole ZR line) captures standard definition video. DV format can provide good, high quality video, but it is not "high definition"... that would be "HDV".
http://gdlp01.c-wss.com/gds/6/0900000696/02/ZR500IM-EN.pdf
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