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Atheist driven from foxholes sues

Atheist soldier sues Army for 'unconstitutional' discrimination

Hall said he met some atheists who suggested he read the Bible again. After doing so, he said he had so many unanswered questions that he decided to become an atheist.

His sudden lack of faith, he said, cost him his military career and put his life at risk. Hall said his life was threatened by other troops and the military assigned a full-time bodyguard to protect him out of fear for his safety.

Hall said there is a pattern of discrimination against non-Christians in the military.

Two years ago on Thanksgiving Day, after refusing to pray at his table, Hall said he was told to go sit somewhere else. In another incident, when he was nearly killed during an attack on his Humvee, he said another soldier asked him, "Do you believe in Jesus now?"

More at CNN....

Now we finally know why here are no atheists in foxholes, they face an enemy threatening their life on both sides...

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more liberal lies.

In reply to: Atheist driven from foxholes sues

they always seem to be reaching for a new low.

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(NT) So what part are you claiming is a lie?

In reply to: more liberal lies.

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I've seen these kind of sore tails.

In reply to: So what part are you claiming is a lie?

They lose their faith, then spend inordinate amount of time attacking everyone else's. I suspect if any of what he's claimed is true, it's because he's deliberately made himself odious to them. When I was in the AF, nobody acted toward atheist the way he claims. If anything, most of them were sort of party animals. What's the big deal about a prayer at a meal? If you don't believe, just politely say it wouldn't do any good for you to say the prayer since you're not a believer and someone else should. Done in that manner, no problem, someone else would say it. Does he think all those believers are members of the same church group? Think they have no differences among themselves? This is just more atheistic hogwash in an effort to be noticed.

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I figured as much....

In reply to: I've seen these kind of sore tails.

You're running your mouth and backing it up with nothing. Why do you think they put a body guard on him?

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you're taking this personal?

In reply to: I figured as much....

This wasn't you was it? You're acting like it was. Life experience as in "been there, seen that" is enough. I knew party animals and have seen a few atheist while in AF, and trust me, nobody had them targeted. The only ones targeted, if at all, were loud mouths, skates, whiners, gays, etc.

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(NT) I take all discrimination personally

In reply to: you're taking this personal?

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even as a woman?

In reply to: I take all discrimination personally

actually, your statement proves my point. Thanks.

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?

In reply to: even as a woman?

You're not making sense there. I'll make it clear for you though. I am concerned with securing justice and fairness in society and with eliminating discrimination and intolerance. I attempt to transcend divisive parochial loyalties based on race, religion, gender, nationality, creed, class, sexual orientation, or ethnicity, and strive to work for the common good of humanity.

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You are intolerant

In reply to: ?

You are using catch words like "discrimination" and "intolerance" in some effort to garner support to FORCE people to socialize with you or other atheist, even when they are completely within their own rights to choose WHOM they wish to have as friends, whom they choose to socialize with. If you feel ostracized, too bad, but it's NOT your right to demand others who choose NOT to socialize with you to do so anyway. You are being petulant about it, just like some child who is upset some other children have gone off by themselves to play without him. Get over it. Find friends you can socialize with. Don't try and force yourself on others. Don't be a pest.

As for my remark "as a woman", the point being unless something applies directly to you, you CAN'T take it "personal". That would be like me saying I take it personal if someone says something racially derogative against Asians, Blacks, or some other ethnic group. It is laughable to even think that could be "personal" to me. Now, if I had some over developed persecution complex, I might erroneously believe it was "personal", but I'd still be wrong.

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(NT) Yep. Intolerant of intolerance

In reply to: You are intolerant

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Does that include...

In reply to: ?

Does that include the Catholic church? You seem to talk about that church more than many people.

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(NT) It just comes up in the news more than others

In reply to: Does that include...

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re: loud mouths and whinners

In reply to: you're taking this personal?

That's a cop-out. I have known Atheists to generally behave as many Christians falsely profess to with bold face lies.

It was a "Christian" that threatened to withold water from soldiers in war who would not join in prayer.

It was a "Christian" who declared that Pat Tillman was "worm dirt" because he died Atheist. It was a Bn Commander and "Christian" who suggested the Tillman family's unhappiness with the findings of past investigations (regarding the cause their son's death) might be because of the absence of a "Christian" faith in their lives. Never mind that the Military was covering up friendly fire casualties.

It was "Christians" who removed and later suspended a student for not reciting "The Lords prayer" in school. It was a "Christian" school Principal who beat the student's Father senseless for having looked into the matter attempting to persecute him for being Atheist.

It was a "Christain" 1stSgt that ordered a Marine who he knew to be Atheist, to lead troops in prayer. And then attempted to persecute him via the UCMJ for respectfully declining.

It was "Christians" who deliberately purjured them selves before the US Supreme Court in an attempt to force their religious views i.e. "Creationism" into our tax supported public schools.

How often do you see Atheists preaching on street corners imposing their dribble on innocent passer's by?

These few examples barely at all touch on the matter. And you speak of Atheists being "loud mouths and whiners?" That's a big fat cop-out.

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Based on what I saw in the military, that's a lot of

In reply to: Atheist driven from foxholes sues

hogwash. It's a guy trying to suppress the speech and beliefs of others. An atheist trying to convert others and/or suppress their beliefs.

The NG units are undoubtedly reflective of their home culture. If they come from religious areas, the unit will tend to display that. That doesn't mean that the unit enforces belief, but esprit de corps needs to be maintained. If the units come from urban areas, they are unlikely to exhibit much religious practice.

If military people want to establish organizations, that is certainly their right as long as the organizations are not subversive. That's one of the rights that the soldier defends, and it is one he or she can enjoy if they choose to do so.

This guy must be displaying some very aggressive behaviour if he needs a bodyguard. Christians don't usually try to do bodily harm.

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Based on what I experience often....

In reply to: Based on what I saw in the military, that's a lot of

I'd say the guy probably was treated the way he claims. People here in the good old southern bible belt treat you like satan as soon as they find out you're atheist. It's amazing how hateful and intolerant some of them get. I find many of them only have that "love thy neighbor" attitude as long as you believe as they do.

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I think there is a whole lot more to this story that CNN,

In reply to: Based on what I experience often....

of course, is not telling. The guy goes out of his way to attack a Christian officer organization and its goals. That organization did not attack him. I am quite certain of that. If that organization desires to evangelize, what is that to him? Its members have every right to have a religious point of view, and the organization has a right to have goals. That is one of the places where his agenda shows, and it raises serious credibility issues.

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Baiting, that's what they do

In reply to: I think there is a whole lot more to this story that CNN,

First they lay the bait, someone questions them on it, they give their spiel about it, accuse someone of something, get called on it, then run to higher ups whining all the way about how they're discriminated against. It's like some kid saying, "hit me and I'll go tell Mommy, then you'll get it", when nobody was thinking of hitting them at all. Of course a few of those and someone does want to giv'em a smack or two. It's juvenile, atheistic, poor, poor oppressed me type of syndrome. Kids do it too. They start whining about something they KNOW will get them in trouble eventually and just keep it up till it happens. This is nothing new. If this world was perfect, they'd just slap him and tell'em to shut up and get back in the ranks and quit bothering everyone.

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That's "atheist mentality"

In reply to: Based on what I experience often....

There's just no getting around it, some people seem born with a persecution complex. Some of them are Christians, some are atheist. I'd say the atheist seem to have a special corner on that though, and particularly this one mentioned.

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So you're saying....

In reply to: That's "atheist mentality"

Christians never ostracize anyone? That it's the fault of those that are ostracized, never the Christians?

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Ostracize? Didn't invite you to be the team?

In reply to: So you're saying....

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??

In reply to: So you're saying....

I find people choose to associate with those of like beliefs. I have atheist friends, we choose to not discuss religious topics. Why would you announce your non belief to a bunch of church goers in the first place? And you must or they wouldn't know what you think.

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I usually don't but...

In reply to: ??

...inevitably I'll be at a gathering, maybe a football or baseball game, where they decide to pray for instance, and when I don't join them they start interrogating me to find out why. I usually respond that I'm humanist but it isn't long before someone starts up with, "that's just another word for atheist"....

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I have never

In reply to: I usually don't but...

had that experience. Most people don't even question why some one isn't praying. You don't have 666 on the forehead do you? just kidding

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You mean playing a football or baseball game?

In reply to: I usually don't but...

I've never seem spectators pray. Teams frequently clasp hands, and the coach may ask for a healthy, injury free game. That's simply the esprit de corps kind of thing that one sees in the military. It says you are a team, and concerned about one another.

So what's the problem? Why make an issue about invoking a god who does not exist? Without God, our lives really have no meaning anyway. We're here today, and gone tomorrow. We have no future. So why get hung up on a meaningless (to you) exercise?

On top of that, you seem to want to avoid discussing your belief, but insist on making an issue of them. What's wrong with someone understanding who you are? Are you trying to hide from people? I don't get it.

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Huh?

In reply to: You mean playing a football or baseball game?

I don't believe I indicated that I object to believers praying. I only pointed out that it sometimes prompts some who pray to ask why you didn't join them in prayer when they prayed. Most don't ask but those that do usually take it down the road of conflict. They aren't really curious about who I am. They just want to know why I reject their beliefs or they want proof that God doesn't exist even though I don't even make that claim. It is these people I make an issue about. They don't really respect the right of others to believe what they want, they expect you to believe as they do and it's that expectation that deserves to be addressed.

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You have a body guard?

In reply to: Based on what I experience often....

Based on what you believe, if you really believe it, you better get one. Those wicked Christians are coming to get you one night. Don'tcha know it?! Quit being silly Bob, the most that may have happened is you've made yourself antisocial to them and they've moved from "Love thy Neighbor" over to "Ignore This Neighbor". Get over it. Get out and find some friends, maybe other atheist, have some fun in life. Life is too short if you're not facing a new one in eternity, so make the most of it you can. This may be all the time you get. Take advantage of the time and quit worrying so much about fun others may be having without you.

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I've never said that all Christians behave that way....

In reply to: You have a body guard?

...only that some of them do, like the ones that show up in the news. There's always those like you that'll argue that no Christians ever act that way. It wouldn't surprise me if you think the Christian Crusades never happened either.

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reply

In reply to: Based on what I saw in the military, that's a lot of

To say "Christians don't usually try to do bodily harm." is like saying Human Beings don't usually try to do bodily harm."

You must be clearvoient to know that "This guy must be displaying some very aggressive behaviour." Obviously it could not possibly be the other way around. Or could it?

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depends

In reply to: reply

Depends on whether they're coming at you with a bloody axe, or a box of glazed donuts.

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No, I'm not clairvoyant, although I can spell the word, but

In reply to: reply

I have a lifetime of experience with Christians both in the military and in civilian life on which to base my observations. I can also read between the lines of a written account. You don't know very many Christians very well do you?

I guess you think that "Human Beings usually try to do bodily harm"?

Are Christians less likely to do bodily harm? Probably.

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