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General discussion

Apple neglecting Mac customers

Jul 4, 2007 5:00AM PDT

I switched to Macintosh a little over three years ago when I bought a PowerBook. I liked that so much that I bought one of my kids a PowerBook for college. More recently, I bought the other kid a MacBook. I also, just bought an iMac for my home, primarily to work with photos and videos. Now, let me tell you why I am reconsidering doing any more business with Apple.

The iMac never quite worked right; random application crashes, freezes, etc. I worked with Apple Care (their toll-free support line) and ended up reformatting the hard drive, after other attempted fixes failed. After I reinstalled the operating system and all of my applications, the Mac worked well for less than two weeks. Eventually it got to the point that the machine would not boot to the hard drive or to the installation disk. On June 22 I took it to the "Genius Bar" at the nearest Apple Store. After spending about 30 minutes on diagnosis, the "Genius" prescribed the installation of a new Hard Drive. He informed me that this repair would be done in the store and that it would take 5-7 days. The "Genius Bar Work Order" also listed an estimated repair time of 5-7 days. The "Genius" promised that I would get a call when the repair was finished.

After seven days had passed, I took it upon myself to call the Apple Store. Of course, this was June 29: iPhone launch day. I called before they closed at 2:00 p.m. to prepare for the launch and got no answer. I called the Apple Care 800 number and that tech tried calling the store, also prior to the 2:00 p.m. close, and she also got no answer. The tech promised to call me back on Saturday June 30 with more information. She did call back, just as promised, and informed me that the Apple Store had received the replacement hard drive and that my iMac was third in line to be repaired. She told me that, since I was so unhappy with the delay, she had asked that the store move my machine to the top of the queue. I called on Monday, July 2 at 2:40 p.m. to find out how they were doing with my "top of the queue" iMac. I was told that they had just started looking at it and would call me. More than 24 hours later, at 5:30 p.m. on July 3, I called the store again. I was put on hold permanently. When I finally reached a "Genius" just before 6:00 p.m., he told me that my iMac was "on the bench." He offered to call me later that evening with an update. It is the next day and I am still awaiting my call.

My impression is that the Apple Store is devoting all of its resources to iPhone customers and ignoring warrantly work on Macs. Our photo and video editing summer projects are not getting done, and Apple has missed every deadline that it set for itself. It is a good thing that Apple took the word "computer" out of its name, because the company seems to be doing everything it can to drive away computer customers.

Discussion is locked

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Time for a letter.
Jul 4, 2007 5:10AM PDT

Send a letter to Steve Jobs via (old-fashioned) mail way. Remember that personalization makes letters more effective. For instance, if you have a broken iMac or know people who do, tell him that.

--- Cut here ---


Steve Jobs, CEO
Apple Computer, Inc.
1 Infinite Loop
Cupertino, CA 95014

Dear Steve Jobs,

I know you're a busy man, so I'll keep this short. As an iMac user, I'm concerned about the care I'm getting at (store name).

(Short story)

(Name names, times, dates.)


Sincerely,

Your name here

--- Cut here ---


You'll need to edit this letter, print it out and mail it yourself.

If you don't then you may have lost a chance to get some attention to your issue.

Bob

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Great idea
Jul 4, 2007 10:31AM PDT

Bob:

Thanks for the idea and the address. I had tried to find a place to send an e-mail through the Apple web site and had come up empty. The snail mail letter is on the way.

I took the word "Computer" out of the company name, though!

Dave

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(NT) Ooops. Forgot that name change...
Jul 4, 2007 11:12AM PDT
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Mac Repairs
Jul 4, 2007 7:56AM PDT

Sorry to hear about your problems with getting a HD replaced.

Your Apple store was almost certainly devoting all of its resources to iPhone customers on June 29th and on the days preceding the iPhone launch, but that is not very surprising.
Don't misunderstand me, this is not a apology for the bad service you received. Bad service from any organization should not be tolerated.
Someone in the "Tech" department either dropped the ball or was pulled from doing their real job to prepare for the iPhone launch.

As I have mentioned before, Apple ships replacement parts overnight so had your drive been ordered on the day you took it in, June 22, or even June 25 because of the weekend, your part should have been in store by June 26th at the latest; installed and out the door shortly thereafter.

I'm sure you are not particularly happy, to say the least, with Apple right now but your problem is really with one local store and unless customers who are unhappy with the service they receive from that store, pass the information along to Corporate, they will never be aware of any problems. To say that Apple (the company) is doing everything it can to drive away computer customers based on one service experience is an understandable, but unsubstantiated, comment.

I hope your store finally gets their act together and does the work to your satisfaction and that you get a reaction from Cupertino with your mail.

P

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The outcome
Jul 7, 2007 11:13PM PDT

I just wanted to post the final outcome of my Mac warranty struggle. On July 5, I received a call from the tech at my local Apple Store informing me that he had replaced the hard drive and that he had now diagnosed a problem with the logic board. He replaced the logic board (fortunately, they had one in stock) and got my Mac back to me the next day.

My concern is not that a new computer had a faulty component; my concern is that my compter sat there for 13 days before anyone looked at it. The "genius" who returned my machine agreed that this delay was unacceptable and he apologized profusely. I am interested to see the response to my letter.

By the way, I did have the hard drive backed up.

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I'm please you are back in business
Jul 7, 2007 11:47PM PDT

and that the cause of the HD failures has been found and rectified.

You are preaching to the choir when it comes to the delay in getting your machine on to the bench. 13 days is totally unacceptable by anyone's standards.

I could understand the delay, almost, had the required part been out of stock/back ordered which does not happen very often but even then, I would have expected a phone call informing you of that fact as soon as they knew it.

Nice to hear you had the drive backed up, the number of people who do not even give that a thought, is frightening.

P

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re: Apple neglects Mac owners
Jul 6, 2007 5:07PM PDT

Hey, I have experienced a similar problem with a Macintosh PowerPC 8100 a few years ago... okay it was over ten years ago... it wasn't my computer, but a coworker's. The guy was using PhotoShop to create very intricate comicbook pages and his computer was crashing about 10 times a day. then, after about a week of this, his computer just up and died. His hard drive was fried. And the poor guy just cried (sorry, I couldn't resist the rhyme).

The problem was not the hard drive but BAD RAM.

The boss had to send the hard drive to a company to resurrect the data. We found out later that it was the bad RAM.

-just another thought....

And about your main problem, the lack of service... I think you should write a letter to the manager of the Apple store, as well as a letter to Apple, Inc. It seems your impression is correct, the attention gets focused on the flashy new moneymakers... iPhone and iPods.

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That's a recurring story (about backup.)
Jul 6, 2007 9:30PM PDT

How can we teach about backup?

After more than a few decades in this industry I've come to the conclusion it can't be taught except by the student losing something near and dear.

Bob

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Lesson learned way too many times
Jul 7, 2007 12:59AM PDT

I can't aggree with you more. When it comes to computers, people seem to think they should be infalibible. But that just isn't true. And the bigger the hard drives get, the less likely people are to back up. I have learned that lesson myself a few times. I have ALWAYS backed up documents that were part of finished projects, it's the ones in progress that are killers. But now I always keep a duplicate of any work in progress on an external drive. If your on a network, it is so simple to just drag it over every day. If you keep the same name, it will replace it so no problems figuring out which is the latest by having to look at directories or info. Hopefully with Leopard this issue will become a non issue. I am just wondering how much of a space hog Time Machine is going to be.

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Back up and duplicate files
Jul 7, 2007 1:37AM PDT

I back stuff up.

I back up by saving as I work.

I back up by making copies to external hard drives.

I back up by burning to disc - both DVD and CD.

You know what I'm often left with? A lot of duplicate files of which I'm never quite sure which is the most up to date or the FINAL job_comprehensive.jpg

Yeah, I'm not the most organized person in the house. I switched from using a file cabinet to putting in a wall full of shelves where I find it easier to stack piles of work. What I need is an easy way to sync files from drive to drive (thumb drive, to external hd to internal hd... from PC to mac and vise versa).

Just a short rant from a slightly disorganized graphic designer. Wink

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Re: Bad RAM
Jul 7, 2007 4:17AM PDT
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Mac the knife (in the back-up!}
Jul 7, 2007 5:02AM PDT

How absurd to read someone advising the buyer to write the wizard of Jobs a letter! Why not just follow the yellow brick road to the land of talking trees and cardiac challenged tinmen? Just leave Toto at home, however, since this wizard hides behind an impenetrable curtain of gold. Be advised of the law of virtual inverse access: the bigger a computer/IT company becomes the more inaccessible/indifferent its own web site personnel become.

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Now tell us what you would do.
Jul 7, 2007 5:26AM PDT

I read your other posts and didn't find much of use to the owners. You've taken the time to sling a few arrows but let's see if you'll take the time to offer some help.

Bob

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Sending letters to the President absolutely works
Jul 7, 2007 4:57PM PDT

You're mistaken if you think complaints to CEOs don't get read. In fact all mail delivered to corporate leaders gets treated very seriously, especially service complaints. After I sent a letter to then-President Gil Amelio complaining about persistent repair problems with a G3 Mac, a senior staff member assigned to that office arranged to replace my problem machine with a brand new equivalent Mac, and this was two years into ownership. I received the new computer within days of the promise.

Also, it's not common for the stores to do in-house warranty work on laptops; for many issues (I had a defective motherboard issue last year with my iBook G4) you take the Mac to a store for first-round testing and if necessary, the staff send the Mac to Apple's repair depot. I was on vacation in Florida and gave the Mac to a Genius in Miami Beach. They sent it overnight to California and repaired it in two days, sending it again overnight to my home in California. The fixed iBook arrived at my home several days before I did (received by my neighbor from FedEx).

So while YMMV, complaints to senior management are considered and often action is taken. And I don't thing having a messianic CEO in the top office would change that.

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Apple reliability
Jul 7, 2007 6:24AM PDT

First, I thought Bob the Moderator was right: send an old-fashioned letter to the head man himself. Whether or not one receives a response is almost irrelevant as this has to be a better way of doing things than trying to get one's message across by leaving an e-mail at some anonymous customer service server.

Second, Bob: nice shot across the bow!

Lastly, I'm curious why no one is asking the question: why did this Apple product seem to suck so hard? I always read and hear from Mac users about how superior is their product over IBM clones with Microsoft OSs, but onemoremile's problem isn't an isolated incident I'm certain. My sister and brother-in-law recently purchased a Mac laptop and had to return it twice (and they were given new ones each time) for a variety of major issues. I previously worked for an employer who utilized Mac-only products and I found them to be just as problematic as any Windows-driven computer I had ever used.

I'll even jump out on a limb to suggest that the reason typical Mac owners have fewer problems over the life of their machines is because they tend to be more computer literate than the average IBM clone/Microsoft OS user and as such they keep their Macs in better running order than do all the others. My secret to a well-running Windows driven computer: building it at home and forgetting all about Dell, HP, and the rest!

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More literate
Jul 7, 2007 9:57AM PDT

It's not that they are really more literate. It's just easier on a Mac to know what is going on and to trouble shoot. And by the way, did anyone ever bother to ask if the RAM that caused all the problems was what came installed on the machine? ??Just because it is easy to buy and install RAM doesn't mean it can't cause problems. Especially to a total novice. Static, non matching chips, chips from inferior manufacturer's, just to name a few, can all cause SERIOUS problems.??But just as you say forkboy, your secret is building your windows machines yourself. Anyone who's job involves using a computer, should not also have to be a certified technician on that system also. At least with a Mac, day to day trouble shooting is almost effortless. Speaking from experience on more than 15 years working in Windows and 20 on Mac, there a reason that Mac users do not say PC stands for personal computer, but something far less flattering. In all my experience I have never seen a Mac user replace their computer rather than reinstall the operating system, where as with PC users, I have seen that happen on a regular basis. ??And as far as the laptop issue with your sister, yes, the first edition MacBook's did have a problem with the logic board. But Apple stood by their products and took care of it. I actually went through the same issue. But in 20 years and more than 15 Macs, that is the FIRST and ONLY issue I have had with a Mac that was due to factory installed hardware. Where as the one and only time I actually purchased a PC myself by my own choice, it was sent back to the factory within a week after 5 phone calls and simpleton talk from their support personnel. No thanks, I would rather work with something that any layman can solve a glitch on, than spend hours and hours trouble shooting or buying components and building my own machine. If I wanted to do that, I would get a job doing it and get paid. I already have to do it for my family members who own PC's. But when I want an out I just say, "hey, I'm a Mac person, not a PC person. Your going to need a to call a tech for that. Next time get a Mac and I could walk you through it on the phone,"??P.S. And to Bob, thanks for the info. I needed that for another reason and the issue just came up yesterday. Perfect timing!!!! Doubt it will help, but if a letter with my issue (and it has nothing to do with their products) falls into the right hands, it can solve me weeks of research.

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Mac vs. PC
Jul 26, 2007 1:18AM PDT

(sorry the reply is late - death in the family)

You are quite right on a number of fronts and I must confess that when the time comes to replace/upgrade my current home-built machine I know that I will strongly consider the move to an Apple computer product. I am not, as yet, 100% sold and this is mostly due to the great success my home-built machine has provided.

But one thing is a an absolute certainty: outside Apple I'll never again own a non home-built computer.

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(NT) Condolences FB.
Jul 26, 2007 2:34AM PDT
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Thanks for the update and...
Jul 26, 2007 3:06AM PDT

My condolences as well.

Bob

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eMac Recall
Jul 7, 2007 11:48AM PDT

I have experienced the same problem with slow support and many little annoying problems with Macs. I have a lab with about 7 eMacs and 3 blueberry Macs loaded with Adobe CS2. The eMacs are all slightly different models purchased at different times. All have OS X but some have 10.2 others 10.3 and 2 have 10.4, but all have recalls. Because we cannot lose any productivity time we sent only 1 first to get repaired. It was sent in September of last year and did not return until March of this year. I didn't really miss it, with it gone I had a space for my much faster VAIO but that is still a rediculous amount of time for a recall repair. At least now, though, it no longer randomly quits Safari like the rest of them, but it does still tell you Adobe unexpectantly quit when you attempt to close it just like all the others. There are a few features that are well though-out, but as for being more stable than a pc, I don't think so.