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General discussion

Another Opportunity Missed

Dec 14, 2003 3:28AM PST

The capture of Saddam Hussein is undoubtedly a success to be
heralded. The thanks and praises to the coalition military forces
for the mission cannot, and should not, be diminished.

However, IMO, this event did not, and could not, have happened
without input from Iraqi citizens in the form of human intelligence,
commonly referred to as HUMINT.

In all of the press statements from anyone, starting with the Commanding
General of the 4th Infantry Division (the boots on the ground element),
through the folks in Baghdad, and in Washington DC, including the
President of the United States, I haven't heard anyone giving the full
credit, so richly deserved, to those Iraqi citizens who provided HUMINT.
Without that HUMINT, today might yet be a long way off. The military
might have done the heavy lifting, but it was Iraqi citizens who put their
lives on the line and told the military where to go and what to look for.

Failing to assign importance and giving credit for the capture of
Saddam Hussein to these Iraqis is, IMO, an "Opportunity Missed" in
gaining the hearts and minds, not only with Iraqi population, but thruout
the Arab world.

When will we ever learn.

Discussion is locked

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Agreed - NT
Dec 14, 2003 3:29AM PST
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(NT) I agree too
Dec 14, 2003 3:31AM PST

.

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In an article I read, it said
Dec 14, 2003 4:08AM PST

"Saddam's capture was based on information from a member of a family "close to him," Odierno told reporters in Tikrit."

That $25 million (or whatever the booty was) should be paid to that person! IMO It's very important we follow through with our word.

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Several reports are indicating...
Dec 14, 2003 4:26AM PST

that the information came about through interrogation of captured Iraqui militants.

if so credit should be given the intelligence officers and interrogators since they have been slammed so badly by the media and other know nothings throughout this process.

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Re:Several reports are indicating...
Dec 14, 2003 4:38AM PST

Hi Ed,

As time draws out, this will be played up.

The point I was trying to make is that we should
take every opportunity, even if we need to take
certan liberties, to make the Iraqis appear part
of this undertaking. Headline them, give them
something to be proud of. Recognize them in public
as full partners.

I feel this kind of deliberate PR will go a long
way in Iraq, and the rest of the Arab world.

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Re: Another Opportunity Missed
Dec 14, 2003 4:42AM PST

Hi, Del.

According to CBS, while the original lead may have come from an Iraqi citizen, it was more a case of the sort of Humint you mention leading to the capture of a couple of members of the "outer circle," who (under interrogating) gave up the location of a member of the "inner circle," who under interrogation gave up Saddam's location. So an initial lead of the sort you describe led to "rolling up the network" by what's essentially standard police work, based on bad guys giving each other up.
-- Dave K.
Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

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Have you considered, Dave...
Dec 14, 2003 6:55AM PST

Dave, some news reports say that he is talking. Have you considered the possibility that he might in some way "spill the beans" about WMD? What if it results in the discovery of something hidden? That might prove politically awkward, to say the least, for the Democrats and their current "stop Bush" campaign. To slightly twist the old TV commercial, "What WILL they do?".

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*sigh* J.s trademarked message heading. On a function key, perhaps?
Dec 14, 2003 10:44AM PST

.

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Sigh is right, Ian...
Dec 14, 2003 1:12PM PST

Sigh is right, Ian. Now you don't like my message headers. Do you keep a repetition count for other Forum members, or others, or am I the only one?

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No J. You've just being using it a lot lately.
Dec 14, 2003 3:30PM PST

I notice you overlooked the rest of my post. Such is life.

Have a wonderful Christmas, and regards to your wife and son. May 2004 bring you as much pride in your technical skills as any prior year, may your life proceed smoothly and may your son's transition towards adulthood avoid the pitfalls of "everyone's doing it" peer pressure.

Regards and best wishes to yourself and all you love.

Clarky

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Just a thought
Dec 14, 2003 6:21AM PST

Considering the increase in the murders by the "insurgents" of the citizens who have cooperated with the colation, and of those who happen to be in the line of car bombs, etc., there could understandably be some hesitation to offer intelliegence.

There could also be some caution while expecting some retaliation for the capture.

Thus it may have been thouight best to not laud the citizens specifically. Those against a democratic Iraq once reigned through terror for 30 years, and terror has continued to be their weapon.

I believe we will pay the reward, and it could very well go to several people. But the recipients might have to live in exile until their country is safe for their return.

Just another way to look at it, Del.

Angeline
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

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Fully understand, Angeline
Dec 14, 2003 8:04AM PST

Acknowledging the potential for retaliation and
risks posed, I just thought that the capture of
Saddam to be THE headline of the Iraq experience,
and without naming names, this was an opportunity
to show the people of Iraq, and in fact the Arab
world, that the Iraqis were equal partners as
different than an occupied people.

From the news reports, the troops went over this area
once, and not finding anything, were directed to do
it again. To look for anything that appeared the least
abnormal in it's immediate surroundings. The
'actionable intelligence' was so specific, that it
couldn't have come from anyone other than an Iraqi.

The thrust of press conferences and the media should
have been to give the Iraqis credit for the capture.

Our PR approach with respect to winning the hearts
and minds, is abominable, to say the least.

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I was thinking down that line as well Angeline
Dec 14, 2003 2:22PM PST

Any credit given to an individual/s would probably spell death to them.
It wouldn't do any harm though for the intelligence to make it very clear that they had fantastic support from some Iraqis, which enabled them to capture him.
No specific names would need be mentioned to give outstanding credit to the Iraqi people in general.