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After Windows 10's big update, my system reboots randomly!

After this last Win 10 update (the big November one) my machine has developed two quirks. The beast is a 64-bit Lenovo desktop with an AMD FX 870K 3.6 GHz Quad core processor with 16 GB RAM and a 2 TB hard drive (with 1.7 TB free space.) I am also running both Malwarebytes Premium and Norton Security on the machine.

Since the update, the machine sporadically reboots itself. Timing is random, and frequency is about once every day or two. But it is not associated with opening a program, or any specific program. For example, today I was reading a long email and the machine just rebooted. The reboot seems normal, but annoying.

The second quirk is that about one time out of 2 or 3, when I cold-start my machine each day, it comes up normally, and after the desktop comes up, MS Word opens -- and when it does, it is always two or three instances. Close one, still there. Close two, still there. Close three and it is gone. Everything back to normal.

Neither problem is a disaster, but both are annoying because I cannot control them. Any ideas or suggestions would be most appreciated. Many thanks!!

--Submitted by: Ward D. (aka CNET member Deutschw1)

Post was last edited on December 15, 2017 12:31 PM PST

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A crash, or a shutdown/restart?

In reply to: After Windows 10's big update, my system reboots randomly!

When you say reboot, are you crashing suddenly to a blue or black screen, and then it reboots? Or, is it an organized shutdown?

If it's a crash, how old is the machine? Have you checked the heat sink? If your fan isn't turning, or if the heat sink is clogged with dust, then it could be heat.

I'm not the greatest house cleaner, so I clear out my heat sinks every month or two.

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Win 10 reboot

In reply to: A crash, or a shutdown/restart?

Seems to me that the screen goes black and the machine reboots. Will check cooling and blow out heat sinks. Hose is generally clean but last time I blew it out was beginning of Fall so will try again.

Thanx for suggestion about monitor software!! And I will try to update the drivers too. Is it worth it to buy automatic driver tracking/updating software??

Thanx again for the ideas!! And if you have ideas about where Word is hiding so that it starts when machine starts, that would be helpful too!!

Best wishes for a goo holiday season!
w.d.

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Try a diagnostic start - and no!

In reply to: Win 10 reboot

If you are not sure whether you are getting crashes or some other reason for the reboot, you could try a diagnostic start, F8 at cold boot (or the Win10 equivalent thereof) and select the start option that disables automatic restarts. If the machine crashes, you'll get a blue or black screen of death (BSOD) and it will stop. The error code, if any, will give a clue to what happened. Automatic restarts will resume at the next reboot.

As to Automated driver checkers, along with many others, I believe they are more trouble than they are worth. Get a list of the components in your system (Belarc or speccy, device manager, etc) and manually check on the manufactures' websites. More onerous that the automated systems, but a lot less dangerous.

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Thanx very much.

In reply to: Try a diagnostic start - and no!

I will give it a shot. I also downloaded recommended software to give me temps, fan speeds, etc. but I do not know what is normal for these, so they are interesting but without a reference, not as useful as they might be.

w.d.

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After Windows 10's big update, my system reboots randomly!

In reply to: Thanx very much.

https://www.google.com/search?q=AMD+FX+870K+3.6+GHz+Quad&oq=AMD+FX+870K+3.6+GHz+Quad&aqs=chrome..69i57&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
DId you install hardware monitor from cpuid ? launch the program, expand the + on each,on the top of the list it will have the motherboard, a few down the cpu; you can save monitoring data in txt file or make a screenshot and add it here.
As the cpu is the only hardware you listed more info is needed as, 1 the cpu may not be an fx processor or the motherboard does not support fx line
Tom's Hardware http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/325915-28-chips-backwards-compatible-boards
Ebay https://www.ebay.com/itm/AMD-FX-870K-FD870KYBI44JC-3-6GHz-Socket-FM2-4-Core-FX-800-Series-65W-Processor-/122533386602

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+FX-870K+Quad+Core

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=AMD+FX+870K&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3AAMD+FX+870K

The information is not 100% accurate across information so the only way to know for sure is
know what is physically in the system.
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Maybe time for a wipe

In reply to: Win 10 reboot

Sometimes, really oddball behavior like this is incredibly difficult to track down, and gets worse over time. It can be a symptom of something else going on. Unless you stumble on a clear cause really quickly, I would recommend biting the bullet and reformatting the drive and reinstalling.

Obviously, make sure you're completely backed up. At least twice. Have all of your programs' registration and activation numbers saved off.

I know it's a pain. But, can you really trust that your machine is reliable, right now?

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Automatic driver tracking/updating software is garbage!

In reply to: Win 10 reboot

Not worth it. They take your money to do something done just as easily otherwise. You can also install the free Lenovo Companion, which does the same thing for free. Windows 10 itself will update drivers, although often belatedly.

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Why not correct that odd startup?

In reply to: After Windows 10's big update, my system reboots randomly!

And I've read where folk blame the updates and I dive in and it's cooling issues or drivers. One of the recurring problems for decades for Windows is drivers. Microsoft and the industry has yet to solve this one so we're always in driver hell.

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After Windows 10's big update, my system reboots randomly!

In reply to: After Windows 10's big update, my system reboots randomly!

First thing would be to narrow down if there are issues with components overheating.
There are some decent freeware programs that can monitor some or all of the pc's workings and some can save the data in a txt file.
These are just a few, cpuid's hardware monitor ( free version), speccy and core temp ; would suggest
hardware monitor as it shows everything in both fahrenheit and celsius.
The other issue can be win10 itself, power and sleep-hibernation settings.
Also check the windows event viewer for issues.

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99.9% Success Rate (or somewhere in there)

In reply to: After Windows 10's big update, my system reboots randomly!

Hi Ward D (Deutschw1)

Assuming you tried the trouble shooting options suggested thus far such as checking for overheating, bad drivers and the like and you’re still coming up short here are my suggestions to be done in the order listed.

#1
If you installed a 3rd party program just prior to or after the update…uninstall it and see if that corrects the rebooting issue.

#2
As you are running Malwarebytes Premium and Norton Security make sure that Windows Defender isn’t running as well. That would be three (3) security programs running at the same time vying for resources, causing a strain on the CPU and possible conflicts with Norton. Norton is a very jealous lady. Truth be told I run Malwarebytes as well but only as a bi-monthly deep scan. It’s been my experience that running two 3rd party security programs simultaneously is bad juju.

#3
If the November Win10 update had just been a typical Patch Tuesday release I’d say delete the update and see if that resolves your problem. Unfortunately, the Win10 November update is akin to what Microsoft once upon a time called a Service Pak. Short story it can’t be simply deleted without causing major problems. Re-installing it again isn’t the best idea either. The solution I’m going to suggest is more of a cleansing of the OS and the registry. It’s an option in Win10 called Reset this PC. Find it by typing Reset this PC in the Cortana search field.

Reset this PC has two flavors one of which will erase everything and another that will retain your personal files but will remove Apps and change your setting to default. You’ll have to re-install all 3rd party programs as well. Both will rebuild Windows. You’ll want to choose the latter option.

The Reset this PC process can take as long 2 -3 hours so be patient. Once the process is complete it will search for the latest updates and install them. The Win10 November update may be a manual install from the Microsoft website. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10

#4
After completing the entire Reset This PC process you can re-install your App’s, 3rd party programs and change your PC to your customized settings. However, I’d only install Norton Security at first and run without Malware Bytes for a week or so. If all goes well then install Malware Bytes and see if everything continues to run smoothly. If the problem reoccurs that will be your cue not run both security programs simultaneously.

I hope this or what others have suggested resolves your re-booting issues. Cheers!


Together Everyone Achieves More = TEAM

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About "MS Word" starting at boot....

In reply to: 99.9% Success Rate (or somewhere in there)

Look in your Startup folder to see if a "MS Word" shortcut resides in it. Here’s how to get there:

In the Cortana search field type This PC click the result. The next steps are all left clicks to get to the Startup folder

This PC > Local Disk C > ProgramData > Microsoft > Windows > StartMenu > Programs > Startup

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Good idea but its not there.

In reply to: About "MS Word" starting at boot....

Thanx very much, but that startup dir. only contains one file -- desktop.ini

And desktop.ini (both versions, on my desktop) contain routine startup pointers, but no filenames except for InternetExplorer.

My next move will be to go to safe mode and start one file at a time and see where Word comes in. Trouble with that is that Word starts about 3 times out of 5, and not every time.

Thanx again for the shot at the issue.

w.d.

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Reset this PC

In reply to: Good idea but its not there.

may still be your best option as it will cure all. Good luck!

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Thanx!

In reply to: Reset this PC

Thanx very much!!

w.d.

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Thanx for the Thanx....

In reply to: Thanx!

but did you try Reset This PC and if so were your issues resolved? Cheers!

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No reset -- yet.

In reply to: Thanx for the Thanx....

Updated all the drivers I could find, and just blew the dust out of the machine. Want to see if that helps before I go the drastic approach.

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I had an inconsistent boot, once

In reply to: No reset -- yet.

Fought it for over a month. Posted to three forums about it. Lived with it for a few months, until a subsequent update completely borked the machine, and it wouldn't boot at all.

Mine was a little different. About one in ten boots would be correct. All the others, a bunch of my programs wouldn't load.

So, if you do decide to keep fighting this, or to live with it, make sure you have a viable backup system in place. You may find that you don't have a choice sometime in the near future.

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Back-up...Back-up...Back-up

In reply to: I had an inconsistent boot, once

Great point about the back-up. Thanks. Forgot to mention it.

Cheer!

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There’s another option

In reply to: No reset -- yet.

If you don’t want to execute Reset This PC you can try System Restore to a date prior to the Win10 November update. The only caveat is that you must have enabled System Restore before hand.

While System Restore will work in some instances I personally find it to be less effective than Reset This PC. Also, System Restore too will remove any 3rd party programs that were install after the date you select.

I’ll forego instructions on how to access and run System Restore (unless you need my assistance) as you seem to be pretty well informed.

One more comment on back-ups... hopefully if you need to restore your system from a back-up it will be one you made prior to your issues.

Once again good luck. Cheers!

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System restore

In reply to: There’s another option

Interesting idea

It might be interesting to give that a try. Thanx for the idea -- yes I know how to do that (but thanx for asking!!) And the only programs I installed since the November update relate to this problem.

w.

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Curious...

In reply to: System restore

Did you resolve your issue and if so what actually worked? Cheers!

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Not yet

In reply to: Curious...

I have tried the driver update and blow it clean approach first. Since the issue is sporadic, I want to see if it is fixed (has not recurred since) and then decide on slightly more drastic measures if needed. Going back to a previous restore point will be next. I really do not want to do a full dump and rebuild unless it gets really bad, as this is a serious PITA (as in Pain In The Neck!)

Thanx for your advice and interest!!!

Ward

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99.9%

In reply to: 99.9% Success Rate (or somewhere in there)

Outstanding post! Some-where's I read, maybe even on the Malwarebytes site, that the new "PREMIUM" is basically a stand alone anti-virus, anti malware program! If I recalled this correctly(?) then if running both at the same time could pose problems!

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Thanks for the Kudo's.

In reply to: 99.9%

I'm also in agreement with you about running Malware Bytes and Norton at the same time. Especially so if as you say Malware Bytes is now a stand-alone program.

Cheers!

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Re: thanks

In reply to: Thanks for the Kudo's.

I went to their web page Malwarebytes and "IT DOES STATE" that!!! Their new "PREMIER" states that!! It's no longer conjecture, it's there in black and white!!

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Re: Malwarebytes premium

In reply to: 99.9%

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RE: RE

In reply to: Re: Malwarebytes premium

Notice in your own post "They say it's quite well possible to run it in combination with a traditional antivirus." They did NOT say 100% okay (factual) It's also possible that at 67 years of age I might "possibly" become and astronaut!

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Re: possible

In reply to: RE: RE

"Quite well possible" was my own summary. The word they used was "recommend":

"The company describes it as an antivirus replacement, and many users treat it as exactly that. I recommend using it in conjunction with a more traditional antivirus, though. "
Just his opinion, maybe.

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RE;, Possible

In reply to: Re: possible

Okay, I can live with that. My point was "IF" he's running the PREMIUM version that Norton and PREMIUM could be fighting for king of the hill.

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Try uninstalling Malwarebytes

In reply to: 99.9%

Honestly, I worked on a computer with a boot loop issue after the latest update that also had both Malwarebytes and Norton. I updated all of the system drivers I could from Safe Mode and uninstalled Malwarebytes. One or both of those things ultimately fixed my issue. Either Malwarebytes became corrupted after the upgrade or it truly wasn't playing nice with Norton. I did not reinstall it to see if the problem reappeared or not. I was just happy the boot loop was resolved.

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