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A Neocon Recants!

by Dave Konkel [Moderator] / April 2, 2006 1:06 PM PDT
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(NT) (NT) Oh you're too funny!
by Evie / April 2, 2006 1:08 PM PDT
In reply to: A Neocon Recants!
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In the words of...
by J. Vega / April 2, 2006 1:28 PM PDT

In the words of Hedley Lamarr......Give the Moderator a harrumph!

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Where does Kevin Phillips fall on the spectrum these days?
by Ziks511 / April 2, 2006 2:49 PM PDT
In reply to: A Neocon Recants!

I saw him with Tim Russert on CNBC talking great good sense and he was scathing about the Bush (GW Jr.) fiscal disaster and all round mismanagement. His conclusion, better hope nothing important comes up in the next 20 years while the US gets its financial house in order or we're screwed.

I used to dislike Kevin Phillips but now he seems like a very intelligent moderate guy. Guess I've just caught up, or he's moderated some.

Rob

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Fiscal disaster?
by Evie / April 2, 2006 10:36 PM PDT

The economy is the best in many years Rob. Wake up!!

We need to get a fiscal house in order on the future of SS, Medicare and other "non-discretionary" spending that is "mandatory" and people are "entitled to". The Dems have seen to it that we don't do anything of consequence in that arena. Sad

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If my personal finances....
by Josh K / April 3, 2006 1:35 AM PDT
In reply to: Fiscal disaster?

....were in the same "good shape" as the US economy, I'd probably be in jail.

If you were in the kind of debt this country is in and despite your debt, continuing to spend a lot more than you were making, would you consider yourself to be in good financial shape?

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(NT) (NT) The U S economy is NOT the U S debt
by duckman / April 3, 2006 1:44 AM PDT
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So Clinton's economy was a disaster too?
by EdH / April 3, 2006 1:53 AM PDT

We had a huge National Debt then, too. It didn't just appear overnight during the Bush Administration.

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Debt stopped rising during the Clinton Administration
by Josh K / April 3, 2006 1:59 AM PDT

Which way is it going now?

Google "National Debt Clinton" (without the quotes).

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Briefly...
by EdH / April 3, 2006 2:14 AM PDT

At its highest Clinton's Debt was the same as the current Debt as a percentage of the GDP. You can't deny that there was a massive Debt under Clinton.

Saying Bush has wrecked (or whatever the curret lib claim) the economy is completely wrong.

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Do you have a mortgage?
by Evie / April 3, 2006 2:15 AM PDT

If not, it's because of the housing market differential between TX and NJ and not really typical. Most people have mortgages they pay over 30 years borrowing several times their annual income. The national debt must be viewed in comparison to the GNP.

What IS going to get us is the increasing in "entitlements". I'm not happy about the prescription drug plan -- only would say that any Democrat whining about the cost should remember that their programs would ALL have cost more not less. SS and Medicare must be fixed.

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(NT) (NT) That and our negative savings rate
by Dragon / April 3, 2006 9:11 AM PDT
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I did
by Josh K / April 3, 2006 11:08 PM PDT

And I was making payments every month, which brought the total amount I owed down a little each month. I also wasn't continuing to spend money I didn't have and running my debt up.

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You do realize ...
by Evie / April 3, 2006 11:24 PM PDT
In reply to: I did

... how much of that spending is the result of Democrat imposed "entitlements" don't you? Actual discretionary spending has been held in check in this Adminstration. Hard to believe, but it's true. Any time Bush calls for cuts in some non-performing or wasteful program we get the "but they'll starve" whining from the left with no alternative but to spend MORE. What's your solution?

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And you do realize.....
by Josh K / April 4, 2006 12:01 AM PDT
In reply to: You do realize ...

....how much of that spending is the result of Bush imposed "invasions" don't you?

Blaming it all on the Democrats is as easy as it is inaccurate.

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I don't blame it ALL on the Democrats...
by EdH / April 4, 2006 1:12 AM PDT

just most of it.

You act as if the National Debt just materialized out of thin air. We've had it for decades. Both parties spend way too much.

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Also, 9/11, Katrina..
by EdH / April 4, 2006 1:36 AM PDT

Little things like that. And I don't want to hear about "Bush's invasions". They were necessary and if the previous guy had done his job we would have taken care of them long before.

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Please ...
by Evie / April 4, 2006 1:28 AM PDT

... it's a DROP in the bucket of the total budget. And it has an end in sight. At least it is Constitutionally justified spending.

I didn't blame it all on Democrats. But the "mandatory" spending is largely their fault and payment is coming due. The Republicans f'ed up with the Prescription Drug plan in Medicare only because they enacted a needless one. But, the Democrats only wanted a more costly program.

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I don't know which is funnier....
by Josh K / April 4, 2006 1:56 AM PDT
In reply to: Please ...

....describing the monumental cost of this war as a "drop in the bucket" or your belief that there is an end in sight.

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What percentage of the budget is that "momumental cost"....
by EdH / April 4, 2006 2:13 AM PDT

and what percentage is it compared to the cost of other things that Democrats love so much?

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And THEY still don't understand
by duckman / April 4, 2006 5:27 AM PDT

that national defense is one of few things that the government is mandated to pay for

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Uh, NO, it doesn't
by EdH / April 4, 2006 8:09 AM PDT

Again, what percentage of the annual budget....

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No it does NOT
by Evie / April 5, 2006 2:32 AM PDT

Try here: http://www.financialsense.com/editorials/hodges/2005/1209.html

FY 2004 Federal Govt. Spending of $2.3 Trillion Consumed 26% of the Economy or $8,134 per man, woman and child, or 36% of the economy counting regulatory compliance. The Social Spending portion consumed 58% of the total and has increased 14 times faster than the economy. Individual incomes pay 82% of all federal revenue compared to a 51% share in 1950.

The cost clock on the war does NOTHING to support your position of the high cost of the war. It is RELATIVELY a drop in the bucket.

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I don't get it, both the government, and the American people
by Ziks511 / April 3, 2006 9:09 AM PDT
In reply to: Fiscal disaster?

have more accumulated debt than ever in the history of History, and the country has never been better off. This is Voodoo Economics of the highest order.

Me all I understand is if your outgoings exceed your incomings you're in trouble. I don't understand how selling our debt to China who may find it convenient to dump their holdings at any time in order to cause a fiscal crisis in the United States is a good thing.

I don't claim to have faith even as a grain of mustard seed, but your faith is as big as the Capitol building.

Rob

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About the American people
by Evie / April 3, 2006 9:22 AM PDT

There's been a lot of cherry picking on some of those statistics to present a negative picture (done moreso by the media when a Republican occupies the WH). Net worth is a more important factor to consider, and debt/income ratio.

In the past couple of years, our home has appreciated in value rapidly. Now a while back we refinanced our mortgage and took a little more out so that we didn't have to cash out some other stuff to fund some home improvement/repairs. Our debt increased, our net worth increased more. So I'm sure I'm not helping the ''debt picture'' much as we appear to be on the wrong side of that issue UNLESS you consider that our home appreciated in value 3X the amount we borrowed.

The China/debt thing is a complex economic situation that doesn't lend itself well to ''soundbite'' drivebys.

One thing the government needs to do is stop the pay as you go system for retirement, etc. But AIR, you fully support maintaining the status quo on ''entitlement spending''. THAT will be our downfall, IF younger Americans don't look out for themselves now. Luckily Americans are largely smart enough to NOT depend on the government for everything. It's only a matter of time before SS payouts become means-tested.

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if your outgoings exceed your incomings you're in trouble. .
by EdH / April 3, 2006 12:07 PM PDT

Tell it to the Democrats who started it all.

End all the welfare that causes it all.

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Best economy? Evie, Shirley you jest!
by Dave Konkel [Moderator] / April 4, 2006 5:36 AM PDT
In reply to: Fiscal disaster?

The highest balance of payments and budget deficits of any nation in history. The rise of gold and oil against the paper dollar (the best of a bad lot of fiat currencies) is telling you what the markets really think of our long-term prospects!

-- Dave K, Speakeasy Moderator
click here to email semods4@yahoo.com

The opinions expressed above are my own,
and do not necessarily reflect those of CNET!

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More nonsense!
by Evie / April 5, 2006 2:38 AM PDT

So your money is all in gold and oil now is it? LOL

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(NT) (NT) And a Liberal Rants !!!!
by duckman / April 2, 2006 3:33 PM PDT
In reply to: A Neocon Recants!
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So are you now an adherent of Fukuyama?
by EdH / April 2, 2006 11:08 PM PDT
In reply to: A Neocon Recants!

That IS progress.

All this shows is that conservatives think for themselves rather than walking in lockstep. Fact is there is as much, if not more diversity of opinion on the right as there is on the left.

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