Ep. 1562: RIM death-watch starts today

Today is Thursday October 13 2000 -- my name is Steven -- of. I'm Bryan song. And about and to get -- It's episode 5862. And where we have nothing that we we it feels like we haven't actually talked to -- and had a real regular show for about two weeks because we had all the big announcements -- we had the iPhone for -- -- shall we had our. Keynote you know coverage in the -- had Steve's passing and since then we were pretty tapped out so we haven't. Talked I know -- really missed you guys. And in doing it shows or super happy to be back with our weekly show gamble get her blow you guys sending in your emails and -- -- a lot of if you -- was from last almost two weeks ago so it's like we gotta catch up. We did it leave you -- gonna get back in the flow. And mobile -- definitely and for those of you that that Sharon has taught by the way that the episode numbering. Like two weeks ago and we made a joke about how we were gonna start -- episode -- with episode one of India and that was you'd never know -- gonna get upset about that many of you were concerned that we're going to abandon the show -- -- we are not. Because we are very proud of the longevity of the show. -- -- way of you people there's no am ever let you or the boxes forget that we have done 1560. Whole list of and that's not including special episode is now that you could you could tack on -- than others in the Wiki isn't someone like tracking the special episodes -- Technically made the shows. Numbers more than they are probably because you guys -- -- -- was on -- shows technically one. Apple one was swollen and people needed to stand -- an -- and then other -- and so the numbers are roughly. Sixteen hundreds -- look at the. Are you thrilled that we started off -- -- with times. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Of tech news we actually are starting -- with some sad news Dennis Ritchie who was the father the creator of the C programming language huge influence. On the technology world has passed away at the age of seventy. The conflict that may have happened this weekend this past weekend. Yeah Ritchie went to work at bell labs computing sciences research center in 1967. He was unknown has DO -- as part of AT&T -- -- in the ninety's your chance to listen he's been all over the place but you know being the creator. Of -- the C programming language and every programmer definitely. Should feel this in some way shape -- form at them. Everywhere in the tech world it is a bombers to take a moment you. Just a month for ten -- to some things also -- about some the awards He won just. Recognize what he's done President Clinton awarded -- -- the national media technology. National medal of technology 1999. I UM one other awards for his work elected to the national academy of engineering in nineteen. 88 for developing the C programming language. And for co development of the Unix operating system via sun as. Hughes and pretty box that total. Total pioneer text. -- lessen the -- and Research in Motion. Which again. Continues to confound and amaze us with what appears to be the most astonishing display of incompetent. That I can think of and -- technology. Industry member. Only gets better now dear god that we. The Internet world was on fire lapses if you could use your Internet connected device which might have been a Blackberry product but research -- service which had been. Out since Monday in parts the world. Has now been restored according to executives of one of the co CEOs Michael as readers and one of the founders of rim Blackberry He. But an announcement up on the Internet where you apologize for what it happened but. If there was any worse -- -- to do this. It was this week because see there's this new phone coming out. And there were already reports about how like 50%. Of Blackberry users were looking for some like 47% we're looking forward to the next generation iPhone. That was before they called the Apple forests but you combined interest service outage for three and a half to four days. Still slowly rolling out globally they said its restored but they're still other regions in the world that are still getting back up to speed. And I asked if I don't like -- I'm going to -- -- Apple fluorescent paint it. And then industry cleared those users in the rest of the world of -- that developing world is almost the only market that that Blackberry has remaining -- it. And so they haven't they have. Let people down in the may be the most important market for them to at least stay alive. They've done it not only at a time when the F on forest just came out the latency CIA just -- in a passel of new phones were announced there the nexus prime is a looming which we will talk about in a minute. And it. On top of all of that's. Rim has angry investors who have been threatening to it to it like stage a hostile takeover and or at minimum get rid of the CEOs that. Fitness is the -- -- they're thinking about maybe trying to sell the company and presumably they would want a better price and they're gonna be able effective they -- scene is like completely useless. If it sort of -- like. It's not just the worst possible time it's basically like if you could have engineered a moment to turn your company into a smoking crater this would be it. I mean isn't it a better -- or HP. Because it's pretty it's pretty neck and neck right now that thing is this isn't even in here's the heartbreaker -- it's not even like it was a hack. It's number it was just a rim infrastructure problem and it is a problem that they have been warned about for years they have a very centralized. Infrastructure those Blackberry servers. Our for the most part located in just a few areas so if a couple of them go down. As you -- Not only are there are they screwed but there they're screwed in such a way that they can even respond quickly aiming to convert. Blackberry users like practically the only thing damn Blackberry can do now compared to any other Smartphone -- email. For them to not be any email for three and a half -- -- when the only thing you -- -- -- -- that corporate. Kind of you know com. It's heartbreaking -- it's bad. It's all bad yet I think this is the start I'm sorry but this is the start of -- death -- for me like I just cannot imagine how this company can survive and -- an as an independent entity. Width of the lineup that they also Begin then on top of that even trying to convince people like -- -- seven is gonna be -- savior yes we're gonna do. That page you guys wanna get a come back we're still only game this -- The -- have Denise who had what do you let you do DI if I was a customer I don't care what service I have. I'm gonna probably I'm -- a look at other options. -- three and a half day because everyone who has a Blackberry you talk to your friends you even that are listening you're already thinking what should be the next phone I get. Now it's like I'm definitely not in a Blackberry when you're in that state of minority and I think a lot of people on Twitter -- -- blade I -- -- -- -- where -- nine. To be clear. Blackberry the service has been restored. One of the CEOs Jim -- and -- -- as well as -- the video. -- greatest He issued an apology -- we we we have a little bit to show in house business has learned this is always entertaining stuff. I'm Michael as a release. Founder of Research in Motion. Since launching blackberries 1999 and it's mostly been my goal to provide reliable. Real time communications around the world. We did not deliver an article this week not even close it I apologize for the service outages this week. We've let many -- you down. Could -- if you think that the each file is lemonade I examining program guide you got -- is utterly and common in the -- -- saying -- a strong OS can save a company implements a -- thirty even betting the farm on Blackberry seven -- like. Potentially losing effort I mean I hate to be so. Constantly taking part Blackberry especially now that they are in fact down in -- importantly -- -- But I think they have they have not -- -- -- that they haven't -- us any reason says to think otherwise now. And is -- just like elect. You know. Idea. I think it I think next time maybe go it's Merck is just like a smirk and the smirk. Under the -- not a I'll work on the sunlight the announcement of the salt from. Men yet that hurt RA also in the news this week this -- this clinic. One of those -- I can't believe this happened thrilling moment along with so that -- outage was like and I can't believe this happened moment but not. -- awesome. Where the accidental release. By a Google engineer of almost 5000. Word manifesto and all the ways that Google has screwed up social -- that and how Google plus the complete billiard that was I can't believe that -- happened. -- -- -- With the ball. Okay so -- -- -- who I am sincerely hope it's not fired because he's right on a lot of these points and put out this memo that He meant to be an internal memo. Ironically. In it in a moment -- in fact crushing fire and. It is not tag -- using -- -- -- -- because He was supposed to be sending it internally to his Google friends and mates but you know that circles things sometimes you forget and sometimes it's 12 AM -- even said it was 12 AM and I forgot the circle and -- -- circle it was midnight and I'm not late night on experience Google plus user. So today is He posted this. 4800 word memo and He argues that Google plus was an example quote. And our complete failure to understand platforms and He says that that comes from not very highest level of executive leadership down to the lowest workers. That Google doesn't understand that they tried to build a copy. Of FaceBook with no API. No serious developer outreach and no concept or understanding of the fact that you need a huge ecosystem. And developers to support something like a social network. Yang said Google plus is a knee jerk reaction in a study in short term thinking in -- predicated on -- incorrect notion that's as Facebook's successful because they built a great product. But like you said FaceBook built a platform where then developers flocked to it and started build -- this world around it so now there's all these time sinks. And time sinks you don't talk about -- -- that again. -- times that things that suck your time. At that time sinks. It actually is a word without it -- it is. But -- -- date but they put several together and Google plus -- -- Canada hastily way to put it out there and say like okay we're gonna do something a little different. The look at what's happened now there's a report now. That 60% of users are traffic on Google plus its diminished by 60% people aren't going their nearly as much and I. I can attest to that because it was a novelty it -- got a little momentum but. They added some game developers He uses an -- like a cable or it's gonna say hey. Who who want to throw a few games up on here give it a try but not build those relationships and build out as an establishing foundations to a grown as something -- And He points He says that the developer relations team within Google had to fight. Like crazy. To get an API out you have developers dot google.com site that would at do some outreach to developers even the -- it looks like a childish than a fifth grade effort. But He said -- are struggling heroically. To create a developer friendly platform in a culture in an environment that each -- quote is. At best platform apathetic and at worst openly hostile often openly hostile to the idea and He says the problem that we face -- is pretty huge. Because that we'll take a dramatic cultural change to start catching up and I think this is very true I -- Google. Google definitely. Build it themselves. That's their thing right answer I think that and they have all of the -- arts and all of the arrogance in the world. And I I can definitely imagine them sitting there and -- all we acted especially in that sort of engineer brain that they sometimes volunteer while we have to do with built the thing that doesn't. You know we've talked about how Google's success -- they should they shoot you know they create a lot of products they put out a lot of different things and if you look at just culturally when He says it's gonna take this huge shift. Google at its heart rate there -- the search company -- ended they made their money from -- there at Google ads platform and in search. But did that did that necessarily treat a platform. You know or a world or ecosystem it has anything now we've seen in their past shall that they've been able to do that successfully in any of their products. And that I woods argue the answer would be no I -- we've seen them have successful products. But not platforms now and so. Is his point is -- on the money. It really isn't that -- -- at its heart plugging at it it's awesome that Google has the kind of culture and this was clear from reading some of some stuff about Google that. They have the culture where you can. Send an internal memo like this and not get fired -- apparently. Thanks to -- and in the chat room for sending the story which is normal cycle Tina. But. This story points out He did say again I -- that that the internal PR folks that Google have been very nice and supportive. They didn't want him to think there were even hinting at censoring them and they'd say that they're not planning to -- him and presumably that they're not planning to fire him so that's great. -- and hopefully they're taking this criticism seriously but it sort of hard to know. Where you go from where you go from here -- if you're not the kind of company that has the culture. To do this right. To do diskette out of it ruled that that is now you mean from him personally -- I'm just wondering that about Google like it in Google pull off social. If it's such -- -- if it's going to get anything that didn't like what -- He can't change people in a three to try right if Google is the in aggregate -- -- a person with behaviors and a personality. How do you would change it from the ground up so that it would have. Yeah and I don't know if that's that's not in their DNA. -- so the -- in the in thing about this though as He does did this letter itself shows though that she he's not necessarily. He is criticizing what the companies doing but he's -- does mention in the letter that He. Cares about his company that He -- -- developers and all -- their butts up but he's He wasn't trying to throw Google under the bus. But that's the point here He was trying to make a point to Google internally. Which shows that He still cares about the company now totally -- -- so. -- -- -- Maybe they'll take what He said seriously and figure out a way to turn it around I don't see that but I just said because the because the Google plus traffic has been on such a decline as you pointed out it sort of -- it's like. The -- too late for Google plus. And Google -- -- -- out there. I don't know if they don't they never said they were trying to make they were trying to have it take down FaceBook percent and of that was -- -- for at all if they don't. I don't. Oh yeah and and I don't know I don't know if they I don't know I think -- -- Danish guys I know you feel that -- and I totally due kind of a new YouTube but at the same time. There's so -- in this tackle a certain industries. I feel like some people just trying to get they're happy. With knowing that there's this established dominant player and they're happy with getting maybe ten or 20%. In a -- that's. That's kind of how they would measure the success of product they would wish ideally that they could be a -- -- but. I don't personally think that'll those companies are out there in -- -- tablet makers they wish. They can take -- you know let's say Apple's iPad but. The way that they operate seem like they're happier just -- immediate and 20% market via I don't know -- -- -- -- I don't think that's how Google thinks the -- films kind of -- but I think the way Google thinks is take over the world. Yet or should I mean and there are many like quotes and there's if there's a lot of supporting evidence for that behavior Google is just like oh if we do something -- -- they're like map in the world and photographing the world so they're trying to take -- For sure okay -- united. I -- -- and as I understand they're not. Am I agree they're not always anchored at. Yes he's got a -- definitely think it's is this gonna work now let's look at their paid how many products they have. And see you know they do you wanna take out over the world I don't know how many of those are actually taking over the world other than let's say their search. -- I -- -- -- -- I don't know of course Google docs is pretty strong in our world but I don't know about how much it really trickles down to the outside. Interestingly Android is almost despite Google one of those things that has built up a significant market share. Which leads us sort of nicely into the next story that's why it was -- that and about it the galaxy. Google and Samsung delayed earlier this week delayed the arrival of the what is being called the galaxy nexus we don't actually officially -- -- -- that we're kind of assuming negative -- like the worst kept secret in technology and apps but -- mule. It's been called both -- galaxy nexus and the next Crimea. They delayed the -- which was supposed to be October 11 at CT IA the big -- -- conference. They said that they agreed to. That given the circumstances of the week it was not the right time to announce a new product they give a follow up statement and to CNET -- Samsung spokesperson -- thing. That -- the death of Steve Jobs prompted that decision. There has been. Skepticism. As -- since then including -- me a little bit. But no and -- for sure. Yet they. It's one of their PR people said there was nothing technically wrong -- stopped them from announcing its not like there was a delay in the actual product red that it tennis surfaced day or two later because every once and what's wrong with your phone. What's wrong let out. Yeah I mean and well there was like a Russian blogger this week -- -- -- born -- was quoting him a Russian tech blogger -- They think it's a lot of inside information that was talking about how there were some patent related issues and things they were pulling out of the operating system am. -- Me personally. I would have just maybe release the phone in a press release and saved the marketing campaign for later like it doesn't I think that this them. Delaying the entire announcements. Is a little bit. It's a little weak like the fact is that their worst circumstances that were happening in yes it was. Everyone was upset that Steve Jobs passed away but the iPhone four -- came out -- you know -- at a budget you can afford to do that if if in fact there's nothing wrong with a phone I think you could of at least just had a more toned down announcement. So that you got your name out there -- permit from from a purely personal perspective. I am in a position where I'm deciding between these two phones as a consumer Steve Jobs death does not change that doesn't make me less upset about it. It also doesn't change the fact that I'm a consumer in the middle of a purchasing decision and -- singing Google -- lost some ground here. It also depends on who their target is all right you're that you're the tech savvy you watched you read and pay attention -- -- news announcements but the general consumer. Everyone's getting drowned out by the iPhone four -- Steve Jobs -- student and will there will their message actually get through. To that to that to that -- I don't I don't -- I don't think so. It's an -- needs to write if you believe in the phone you can market it later especially if it's not coming -- clearly whatever they were gonna announce was not gonna be the release date. Presumably so if it's not so then as you get closer to the release date. You can -- you can ramp up your marketing you can hold another -- event if you need to you it's like it doesn't always have to be -- -- keynote thing but you goods. At least -- some than release something some information because it just. They're the only company that did that and I think it's -- weird I just IA I have to say from a purely like just a gut level I am skeptical. It's a nice -- film. -- I wanna get -- yeah. And not like exist in -- -- the curved glass I feel like editor at Fermi is just it's stumbling around on its last leg -- is still close. To tip it over the ads they have so had -- with the Android experience and then this to me just makes me feel like they're flaky. Which they have been all along like updates never -- when you think they're gonna comment it's -- Hard -- -- in her -- -- come I don't know all Android has it's advantage but that's one of the things that you sign up for unfortunately. And now you're feeling it more and more over time. -- told her year and one of the things you sign up for. You knew it was a -- when you send out -- -- but now hey. My my update why does Joe -- get update on hysteria why am I waiting three more months and then when I -- it it doesn't work -- with the sentinel fort. I'm sorry. That you know that apparently now I know that but I'm pretty sure are valid and in their marketing material. And it -- to be on it will titles -- -- let's not say that everything is always smooth when -- update on iphones either okay. Yes let's just throw that out there before we Don valley had many of risk that's out. Well yes and actually many people are having wrecked that and -- -- I'm not I am not saying that they're flaky because of this one -- to be clear this is not the thing that makes -- -- But Google has been flaky with their response to you Android updates went with -- with announcing you know new version -- don't come out for mines blanket and a little. The history. The -- -- this particular thing -- you know for all I know it's absolutely -- on the Internet but I I thought that it was a little minimally. It was us -- maybe go. It's always fun to deal little -- that's what our job is -- you know let's take a press release and turn into a ten minute conversation. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- I and its current PS. That's what's new the new -- you know -- -- on the next year curved glass on I want -- -- absence. Earth class. C. I keep saying for glasses out of school ball. I did have you had a curved glass phone I don't know that's. What it electronic formats from your year. Current conflict is. Really likes to see that -- danger but they did at least release a picture. Of the nexus prime and others like video ID like that anglers -- figured I guess they can just look at the members of the go that route I'll and in some uploaded in the run -- okay we have the video about the. There's nobody can easily get ask them what appears to be it's like the Buddha there's this and this went -- -- Ice office is now which I -- sale when it's in everyone's excited about this boot up sequence and players here. I can't wait for the look at this. -- all I'm so excited for the boot option joints. Inevitably right at it this looks like the -- -- -- it focuses OK -- tells them. Yet this. Story of what this is an amazing bit of sequence of it was that it does this. Sorry listeners -- -- stick. It puts it better deal and I don't need an I video out on this one only Atlanta we take a little ad break let's and if we come back -- and we have the promo -- to listen to a look at it -- not talk about some. We're gonna make up the shots until. It. And -- back. Not really are a little we'll be back. I -- forced -- -- they are in this. Like a storm of them via we'll talk and I'll say this evening's. -- -- That -- to promote what it. Show. My beloved childhood friend who already -- Week. This it is. -- And now is a storm. -- we -- the video down. So -- you guys and you can watch a video of the boot -- -- -- and I present it better be damn day they don't blow earlier this better be damn tired out. You better deliver seriously. Wrong that -- And desert hills and it's been met weakness in sweeteners that this is with homeless get a working as James. -- -- on the back. For the housing -- a variety of colors -- -- titles like -- plant life show you might have seen this gates yes that is latest array of on the seal lean while your mind it was and -- Cried. As ignorance is now gone on for roughly that aren't out or five seconds long -- like Townsend that -- -- done. Thank you for that suspect that that. Again it will leave -- and listeners are you guys still here because my guys initiative and these measures of this changes for. -- does it does the gotta admit our guys some of them might not necessarily change everything. The reviews of the iPhone forests pretty much getting across the board rave -- reviews. The looks of the outside look like an iPhone for the inside. Next generation hardware you know accommodation valid IOS five that people are loving -- I mean and you agree this is delivered with the people -- eleven you -- verge mentioned the lack of LTE larger display. And the new black company design might put off some. Some buyers may be in this room but that won't change it's -- force to be reckoned with. Most other reviewers agree that it's you brought some and that if you have an iPhone four you probably don't need to upgrade immediately because -- eligible for -- Ivan that even though you'll get teary. You -- you know it's like that's a really cool feature but it's maybe not enough to warrant an upgrade considering that most of you iPhone all of -- iPhone four owners are not out of your contract. I would not I would agree. My -- seventy humans normally you know sometimes when this congress so hot -- break my contract and get it anyways but when I got two months ago. I'm not gonna spend 250 dollars in two months just to get -- the talk to my phone because it's my only friend that I have. So I think it still -- outgoing -- Think it could still make your friend but can you ask the phone will you Mary Meehan will respond effort because we've seen all these. You know they but a lot of it's cool stupid you'll see a bunch of them is they're all these tweets Glenallen what you -- a series cameras on school. They do like the camera -- meal like again -- -- really -- -- Cameron haven't organism was really telling me train them and a new one found in them you don't -- positive things to say about the Apple for us and Walt Mossberg -- I was front -- serious He well He is the -- critical. Apple products but sometimes for some reason appears every keynote is like the hardest -- that gives a glowing reviews Sweden. -- -- -- Friend investing awesome -- -- I mean I mean it's -- is right out. Pretty much indicated that they were -- -- yet but in in you know. It's -- to appear also. After the app on -- was announced. It had. -- -- a lukewarm. Reception among detect Technorati amongst the Technorati exactly everybody was like. Not -- -- Nevertheless. Once pre ordered time rolled around the critics were proven. -- analysts. Apple announced that that off iPhone forest pre orders have topped one million in the first 24 hours. Which they said was a 66% increase over the first day sales in the act and for in the summer of 2010 partly to because there -- so much pent up demand at sprint. And and sprint sold out of the low end model pretty much immediately. And -- I think as far as I know now pretty much shipping is delayed. At every carrier right you can't you're not gonna get it on launch day you. Artery that's gonna be about one -- two weeks but the original iPhone four idealism or sell the iPhone four was had something like 600000. Pre orders on its first day this one jumped up to million in. It does. Notes a point about an article He wrote about just how others really -- also in addition to why didn't we see. A new iPhone but there's the two year carrier cycle and -- -- on these different cycles and everyone that has a 3GS which -- which sold. Gangbusters. And even some four people are really at 3GS users and all -- they're the ones that are all these one million forest users are absolutely in leaders. It's kind of like if you're an iPhone four owner. Unless your real enthusiast this upgrades not for you. Lives for owners of the 3GS you're just coming out of that contract mean in some days -- your carrier they've gotten a little more flexible that contracts mean going to bully your way into you know. Subsidized price but for the most part this is totally there are even people still on three G nano looking -- -- -- dynamic and I -- absolutely even though it has. -- Saloon. -- and we talked you talked about your whole love with Android love hate relationship Newton. What are you gonna do with your next phone because you were leaning towards iPhone. Five at that time and now you know what forests has in -- stills it's not as compelling it was before. You don't sound too hot on the nexus prime. And on and heard you title the Droid on eight socket what are you gonna do little daughter is dead to me will let it do you think in an excellent antenna to your polls right now -- -- I am I am in a quandary I can tell you honestly and a decline Ares I was up my plan was wait and see what Motorola what Samsung Angola Google. And who aren't good guy who got what I -- I all my playlist or latency that attempting in Google -- announced at the nexus prime or galaxy nexus or whatever it's gonna be. Oh -- and then decides. But now I don't know what. When not gonna mean I guess I can wait till the 27 and -- at the going to announce -- is probably what I'll do except a major indexes virtually on its last legs because Motorola makes the worst hardware in the world. I can't believe I got bit by it again. But they really it's just appalling how bad it -- and -- about the cameras are and how the touch -- degrades over time and it barely in real music. Touching degrades over camera with their experience -- -- your finger degrading. Maybe it's making significant -- suggests maybe I'm swiping it. You although -- I have thought about to be perfectly honest I've thought about just buying an ACC thunderbolt on you have there. Which -- make it because citing an -- -- -- and -- first -- he's having problems with this honorable. Like -- and figured that to me in an every would have said. While ACC is the only way to go for Android and I and I understand that seems like in a pretty good hardware people have been happy at least with their experiences with HTC. But then there -- that like huge bug. About a Tuesday revealing -- like nobody's perfect and I totally understand that but I am frustrated. With the and higher standard universe are now. They -- the animal may be where ago but I don't know. Are and what I just don't know -- -- -- wanna know where your pulses -- it's kind of like the -- phone you know we're gonna do normally focal as far as the RS goes like. There's a lot to recommend it in some ways but I really like the bigger screen -- and also for me that's just about the money. Like that is a super expensive phone I am not out of contract. I want 64 games and minimum 32 -- and many many Honda Insight that take up pretty seriously. And we'll see but will -- -- -- -- -- And I'm not gonna month. I don't firm it would surprise me if you actually got a -- -- I feel like -- be in the spot where. It didn't get -- didn't get to nothing your just gonna wait for the five and here and get something in between yeah that's -- that's -- -- actually exactly -- and thank you yes you have now there's -- easily -- maybe there's there's wildly into -- under assault from eBay to tide me over and now all either arrive on time or candidates that I think Antuan is on eBay -- -- -- And don't use it except that he's not really dirty fingers through. Out of doughnuts and -- -- I love it between Clinton has -- of the last night okay. Onto the story is thanks for the attendant that was great and that's that's one of the bonus that's a little bonus content you get with and I've been weekly. And now -- our new segment what is up with Molly. Enough for a new segment back to the actual -- show. Him more Apple limited -- Blackberry. He'd stop if you do I'm not I liked my Blackberry in Europe a continent along to my freedom to -- -- it worked for a charm except for the past three days. Apple -- put movies in the -- cloud by the end of 2011. If you guys are checked out the new services where you can access your music and TV shows. You have yet to be able to -- download movies that you purchase and own from the cloud that's -- options so. The time on Apple in negotiations according to Los Angeles Times. To try to launch -- by the end of 2011. That better estimates point 2012. So will -- your movies such -- there was also finally -- long awaited your scenarios on Monday of this week. FaceBook for iPad finally appeared. Finally I -- Hey and then that by far the best thing about it is the photo. Yelling -- bromide that the photos was the one thing. That for whatever reason and safari never worked reliably like they wouldn't load it took for ever it was super slow and it's still even. If photo viewing on FaceBook on the site on a computer is still really slow and that the display in the way it loads loads up on the app is just like -- -- So what I thought I would agree with you the photos are cool but I. Don't actually like the look of that app itself like the navigation I don't know I'm not a it it sounds bad but I wasn't a true I wasn't blown out of one X and -- expected -- be blown away by this but. I was like and now play it almost like there's so much space that they don't use and everything's like justified to the left with like your feeds and -- just looked -- to me. And then you know you swipe to pull up a little different the column with the different sections. Are actually just went back to unfortunately using video web. Each period is to a consistent slash. I homes and admitted now that's interesting I want I actually we guy's email -- but. -- job raising no I wanna know if that's been other people's restraints and I've only used it a little tiny bit I definitely did not. I don't love that constant that I get a slight -- -- -- the time. That's a little bit weird. But. I was excited about the photos parts of its opponents say the -- -- his -- is cool but beyond that. Now -- current and I actually like the phone version of better than I do that dial us five I've I've iPad -- I will say that out on the I had does work better than Apple and Mandarin acts that. -- -- I get back does -- give them enough and it looked like lying. Doesn't am I getting no FaceBook updates whatsoever and notifications whatsoever anymore and my Android on public will need to -- here. -- an afterthought platform I don't know anyway it was at least a sign that FaceBook seems to get it. After Mark Zuckerberg openly declaring that He didn't consider mobile to be a separate platform. They have at least bowed to pressure -- -- -- and put out yet whether people I'm not saying it's bad guys -- just with. That's if you stick with me your review is important to you that's I think that's actually pretty -- -- now. Those just me. Let us know everywhere and let us know -- advocate Christ Christ meanwhile we have yet another reason that you might want to consider quitting -- each week. Apparently. In a dispute in it is there's an -- European campaign group called Europe -- FaceBook. It's trying to find out exactly what information FaceBook holds about users the group's founder. Requested. From FaceBook that is but give him all of his personal data. Okay so that He could find out exactly what data they keep on him -- and please send me everything that you have on -- and FaceBook said. Based extent some stuff a CD-ROM story over 800 pages but this -- Macs trams noticed that important information was missing. And so He contacted FaceBook again and asked for those extra details and FaceBook. Refused. They said. We've given you all the personal data to which you are entitled pursuant to section four of the Irish data protection act 1980 to 2003 source -- -- that it would be really hard. Seagate in the rest. Is at it and and super legal language like actually to. -- that era beckons and I don't really. And so then they said in addition to it being really a -- a lot of work to -- -- -- personal information that in fact. They. They are allowed to withhold information if the disclosures would quote adversely affect trade secrets or intellectual property. We have not provided any information to you which is a trade secret or intellectual property of FaceBook Ireland limited or Netflix enters. So. They're basically seen that. All that information that you plug in some of it. Pretty much becomes their proprietary data that is theirs. Is -- becomes trade secrets and you can't get to it. The your information. -- let -- give it to -- that's also. I'm not a sign up for that service should they call -- -- What. -- Take it says that certain aspects of your personal data is a trade secret or intellectual property of FaceBook Ireland limited or at -- -- seems pretty extraordinary. Now the battle is ongoing -- is apparently contacted the Irish data protection commissioner to pursue the matter further days -- said we are cooperating fully. And were -- just gonna keep on earth to Leo. -- and detector I think we'll be keeping an eye on this rights to determine what -- as if in fact the Irish data protection commissioner requires them to turn over. The personal data of the guy who request it. Very interest and we'll see if they and a -- bill 180 much like our friends or 80 my goodness. It then it just keep coming. Nestle Lexus -- over the weekend. Decided to cancel their critics to expand not -- it you probably. You EI know where a weekly show now. And you probably heard about it. But did the if you dig deep inside here and there they don't talk about this fact. But I think one of the motivating factors for them doing this was the fact that they were not able to get the Twitter handle extra. Probably let. You think -- that's all of it but that a virus at. Now the response from the market I was surprising because. You would think that this would have been a popular announcement considering how much rage there was about the split in the first place and how. Everyone had basically said don't do that. But then -- Netflix demonstrated unfortunately a little bit of weakness in their position by saying okay we decide not to do that. There stock. Tanked. -- you look back at the five day. Chart on financed -- Google finance or somewhere. -- Coming up. It's as -- it was like. Riding a rocket right to the earth they -- -- gave a 52. Week low. After that announcement as initial excitement over the strategy reversal -- It finish at 111 dollars now to be fair -- back up to 116 today. People and as maybe some -- -- -- dies down but it cut him it really showed that unfortunately Netflix is in a position where they gimmick and there -- They're all over the place -- in the past six months we've seen them turn off customers it. When you talk about a company where the hits keep come -- like Netflix needs to just be quiet -- -- -- -- and just bring us some more content and to stop. Because they're looking a little cook -- agreed pacing is like a little -- the US ability is He doesn't own -- -- nobody wants by far the best treats that I -- I think every -- -- animate them like it's hard to tell us when I'm getting email from Netflix or -- the -- If I know it's true Netflix -- -- -- Netflix just outside Netflix who never do that again Netflix didn't mean energy -- -- levity He came back. You know. All they have to do is what they did let a few days after or during this whole little -- -- -- is they announce that they're bringing season one of walking dead. And Netflix how they and that's what you guys need to do and you need to stop -- tinkering with your little service than -- it for awhile -- and just give a sketch. And hopefully that's what they're going to do now right I mean I as tempting as it was to really like go after Netflix again for -- insisting -- At least I mean you can say yes that they heard it. They realize that it was not going to work. And they've fixed -- you know I mean. And there's no and -- and and and can from Chicago as saying they can make people happy by rolling back prices. And that's that's not gonna happen like that and I think that the price increases going to stay and probably -- sustain. But the fact is thinking they could ride out that -- -- they had also tried to break the entire company but the best part of all that I got to stop following that idiots donor on Twitter. -- that the court yesterday that that's a -- -- does Twitter stock went higher -- -- -- -- He should of any didn't I think -- had offers to sell this thing and in India He said I mean what is He really -- He should clinch. The effect but -- will we see what he's really doing in an intentional emotional and that stuff you can than. I don't know that meet the case I'd just like that on. There's a funny app basis even for planning attacks and mortgage or crickets likenesses of the funny part of the show I love this is the new app. For Android. This. Thing called. I'm getting arrested but at the at. And what does it -- Molly -- It all it does is let your friends and family know if in fact you've been arrested. You just very helpful so it this is actually and I like that Jay -- comedian who -- it up for CNET points out that they're a good place to use this is that you decide you're gonna join occupy protest. Where -- -- to just be arresting people -- will. In various cities -- -- that always works good idea. But they say before you head on down with your -- to join the protesters that you might want to enter in your custom message. And some SMS ready numbers to contact in the event of your rest and then just as you're about to be. Pushed into the patty wagon and click on that -- entirely -- live on preferable -- reduced second. And bloom -- -- attacks including a vineyard times or whenever I hope I had directed I hope you're gonna -- now their hands behind your back because it knows that. Cops gimmick they're arresting hundreds of people. Decide your phone out and it is I found -- -- -- And oh. Actually that's funny they just sign headlined on Twitter about how cops are struggling with social media is people -- like stop doing pattern in between -- that at that. It's available now and Android market just you just need some add here occupied toolkit. You know how long -- would last in gym I've become someone squirrel. In a law like real fast now do that I tablets have a. Alright guys foursquare. Turns on the radar for -- OS five users pretty much it looks like. Location finding where your best these are very U Lar and yeah it's -- -- like a little find my friends -- latitude thingy is Aaron. Dad -- today and it kind of duplicates in there is that service now built anti us a little bit of -- Google Latitude -- that this will. It's a notable improvement they say and then at -- thing that makes may be forced we're still relevant new from the looks like it -- because I just read the article it looks. Ticket is little more acidic to -- -- And happenings around you with foursquare which actually I like that yeah that's where the only time the foursquare and it seems that when I just -- disguised as Yahoo!'s. Apt to. -- I never actually use it but it's useful at things like south by southwest or whenever when everybody is -- -- in one place in -- need to find your friends -- One of them. There's a new study released by the CTN the cellular telecommunications information of America and and I -- there realize. What -- and -- really stands for but their cellphone. Industry Europe. Says that the US has found that the US has more subscribers to wireless services then people. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- They think this is the first time that there are more mobile devices in use then there are people living in the country this actually does OK because if you look around -- the business people have the iBooks and finally and let people a lot of volatile and personal phone. Okay I thought it was just like a bunch of dead people would not even been canceled -- self defense against it could be that -- latitude there's some of those numbers. We factored in actually okay. -- is trying to be -- particular human look at the according to the organization at the end of June there -- 327. Point six million wireless service subscribers in the US compared to three in in fifteen million people living in the country in territories that actually that. The small an adult and about it is made up almost solely of people that'll work and and a -- so could that small delta also be part of our rich white -- -- Didn't respond like people and their -- phones. I'm just so I had to be like a buzz report -- video segment. And now time for people and their two phones. -- -- -- I've -- and let the air partly Wilmington from the they're not all -- don't get mad chat -- Three don't get mad at each arias won on every carrier just for fun. It looks like a legitimate -- like that but it's not an Android app is circulating -- looks very much like the real Netflix. And it's actually a Trojan that steals your account information so when before you install Netflix and a hundred and they're pretty rush to do nexus citing. The kids is -- carefully this doesn't photos this is a smarter and say this is a smart -- though because everyone was like. When is Netflix on my phone yeah and let's be honest views and sometimes click dispersal -- the Nat reversal when you see does -- make sure you get it. From the market. And it says an Android market. From the company who developed -- and yeah be careful with it. Privacy alert Verizon has sent out -- privacy update notices that I got and immediately recycled -- -- on the story. They're making significant changes to their privacy policy for mobile users. For example. The company will now use a lot of your personal information including the URLs of web sites you visit over Verizon's network and your devices location data. And they will use them internally and may be share -- with outside companies. Presence has -- personally identify you but for example your search queries might be contained in the -- answering of the web sites you visit. So you might wanna be aware of that and go to Verizon Wireless dot com slash my privacy and opt out because of course. They're opting you in publish you lived there please opt out if that's a good idea -- opt to strong strong strong stance to take that's our recommendation for today. Okay Mueller -- Shift over to little but the science -- Steve and I would like you to champion this story does is okay and houses on that story and looking for -- That area but. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- I did just -- -- a bad yet I so there's a new half that just came out. Like that lets keep it escaped the allied Noah and amber that if yes -- -- and -- Apple help you figure out what kind of birds that you're hearing go around flex is AM for your phone. So you go around your happy bird watching at your binoculars out and Andy's here bird like I wonder what that is -- -- -- -- -- car and I mean I wanna. Anyway it's really cool and sciences have have actually -- Three -- and it's also capable. This finding crickets different species of -- it'll tell you what kind of cricket and also frogs. So it's pretty cool and very uses include deal long -- squawking train that's actually really rare -- absurd does yes. I just zealot I just me -- -- -- -- it can tell you which species you're hearing and it can also identify individual birds from their song. -- -- -- That that's that is amazing that we need to take this technology and incorporate with people. Like for example interpret the tone of voice of -- When -- squawking Porsche really. So what if she would issue really trying to tell you. -- that's about one and now -- -- it's very important. That would like and with -- videos. -- ceremony -- that's gonna for personal use. Those maybe those are the kind the comet that happened on infant -- -- Is that my segment. Keep it on the inside and an inside looks at what's up with volleys. Getting -- those Steven Vincent put on the outside lands on you should keep -- on -- and we're gonna make standard for all three of those in the near future some of the new great contents -- -- getting with the weekly -- talent show. Above the earth he's actually we -- We have as many emails as we normally do because of web not having a regular shipment to east but we do have some and we -- to keep them -- and we also have a couple voicemails as first line. Very interesting about some of the early bugs that are being spotted. -- -- -- It appears that Apple's -- a key -- bit. Terrible idea from that photo app called color. Because if you updated Iowa. Have photo stream -- on devices. -- -- you'd think Margaret glittery out of focus indecent inappropriate. Or. Could potentially. The make you associated with the current. Yet instantly gets uploaded I and then duplicated -- your devices and there's no wait until we. Think Apple. Should. It takes that Apple is absolutely -- that the whole photo stream. No matter what it's cool when you well you can't delete you can't delete any photos off of it so you know sometimes it -- screen shots for stuff. And the photo personal photo stream very cool right instantly pops up on all your vices button there is no function and there's no setting in any app that I dug for. That allows you to delete any photos from that photo stream clouds action. So they needed they needed they really need to fix the glad that. You should get and also you know they may think that it's that this is. Some of the Apple over oversimplification that does seem to drive me crazy like maybe it's a little more work for you to approve each photo. As it gets but like Google hasn't the instant upload and -- T with Google plus thread if you integrated your Android phone with Google plus you can. Have instant upgrade. Enabled but you still have to approve posting them anywhere like you that there needs to be some kind of a checkpoint because -- a lot of photos of people take that they don't need to keep even. Let's let's have them instantly uploaded to the -- -- And even if like okay if I get -- system a little photo -- there's no personal photos and relishing guys but you -- just let me. Click on a feud that delete why would you ambulance on reading and you can't do it I mean I like the seamless idea like take a picture appears -- cool. But at least after the fact at least let me delete. I can't I can't delete this cute picture of mass of -- With that I can look criticize. -- -- can't -- MacKey so -- is wrapped up an ethernet. Back. So but I've also been set on the inside oh and god no no I'm so happy that happen now allowed us. I mean that is a pretty serious privacy concern especially. If you use a Mac at work and -- have enabled your personal account. Acute I mean I think you want to be very. Careful. Like. Cloud storage is always a privacy concern for many many reasons not -- you know least of which is that it's gonna hackable but. Automatic cloud propagate cloud based propagation of your personal data and sounds really good in theory is -- a year you're absolutely absolutely I think is that I am Molly rant for today. Tends to look for that in column form later obviously as with any of and about matter -- -- moment on news.com smiling. Well talk about the -- and out right there are as well as always with. Apple upgrades or a separate -- separate them any time and there have been many reports of problems I think I cloud was down for allow deep in algebra in -- -- that. Now with their servers were -- I cloud is still like -- of working sometimes sometimes -- which is your email in the cloud. So it's gonna be kind of predicated on that service running up and council have the time today at least my emails not coming in and then sometimes it doesn't and sometimes it doesn't. So you know there -- some growing pains in some issues that every cloud services can of the deal list. Well and -- yeah and it's -- at a public. And answer every cloud service is gonna have to deal with the problem of automatically propagating hired by its of the Dakotas and panning for all you do -- you do have to switch that on first of all but they do need a fix like it by default you have to even turn on the publishing which is nice but you've -- a -- to delete stuff. I like that -- you're not opted in to yes you are not opted that's. -- -- -- -- We'll love corrections on the show them eat mainly because they help keep us honest and also -- cracked us up. And this is the kind of an old correction at eight all the way back to that day that we did the live coverage at 6:45 a am of Amazon Kindle -- in -- weeks ago I was three weeks ago still relevant. But still relevant because this is like. My favorite correction in numbers on time. You're I was listening to -- Amazon press conference at the school. And you said that the Nintendo three yes. Launched. 349. Dollars but it absolutely incorrect. The Nintendo three media launched in North America. 249. Dollars. Now currently 180. Dollars. Get your -- streak okay. -- But He was seek calling me -- afterwards. Though He wasn't He. -- it's pretty mad about that. Pretty mad about us it's -- it's true we we should Google everything we say over it as it turns out. It did -- actually learning a few hundred -- -- nine -- in the United States and it is currently. Dropped as of July 28. May I correct you back. The T 170. K buddy. Gets it -- straight. -- right all right then you can call back. But the -- I'm sorry that we have face -- Honestly though. IL at the same time I do appreciate you calling -- yes no idea I mean we'll we're glad we're laughing but we do love the fact that you still calling we appreciate it yet it's this is just fun for ambulance and don't take this personally. Keep them coming just lay out -- on the deep -- and besides that -- dollars. They can't hear me angry or your photos appear directly in the more likely we -- to -- it -- a -- it's us it's a love hate thing. John Orlando otherwise known as T -- -- in the chat one of our. -- are constant chatter spank you for hanging with -- all the time says now I know isn't comments on the Netflix widget thing. And I said I know that Netflix wants the dvd by mail business to go away it looks like ports are not a whole lot faster than anticipated. The problem for Netflix is the dvd by mail is still part of their product offering in the camp -- -- how to get rid of it. While keeping consumers happy Netflix can't move everyone to streaming without quality content but the studios are just. Ardent just not going to play ball if Netflix is the only player on the team. They need to form a consortium. Of content providers Netflix Hulu Amazon crackle with the goal of getting competitive streaming rights for all the industry's players but the content consumers actually want. Let the services differentiate themselves on advertising -- subscription models platform availability mobile etc. Netflix would be giving up much of their position in the streaming market. But success here would mean tremendous growth for the market as. -- -- -- the -- arm also in celebration of our feedback -- segment I would like to hear the stinger. Okay theory go oh I I don't really. Consumer. And even -- and now now or in the we haven't initially expected when. Stephen is -- -- -- and -- I just wanted to hear the sounds I felt like I was in the feedback -- segment is one of the additional pieces of content you'll get with the new weekly show here at. By the way that. To that point I don't know that day. An ad consortium may not be needed. If ultraviolet which launched this week as -- that sort of set a new. Its new DRM technology basically -- a new set of standards and technology that's designed to let you store movies and TV shows in the cloud if that could be expanded to include or some or a similar set of standards and technology could be expand -- and -- -- allow for digital distribution. That would get that the studios more comfortable teams like that is more likely -- -- I wasn't gonna happen on the industry side. As a sort of a digital distribution plan. Was was guilty in the cloud I thought it was just the file format that the work on all platforms when you by the justice. Now let's just participating retailers and services will store customers video on their servers and then users can view them the films on a -- source consortium to -- -- tonight. Quickly I swear quickly I just got the -- -- Blu-ray. Blu-ray vast by the but you wanna consider -- -- -- electronic it's close that'll proceeding in the living room but it's. I might be worth it I don't think we have a cement outside opposite at a strip -- -- realism in what was really cool they're they're part of the it. So they were 42 -- Plus 43. Point. I -- no let up you just a -- actually the -- seekers don't mean to say that okay anyways. What's cool is they offer now Tron did this but they also offered a companion. If that Blu-ray disk that shows all this additional content while you're watching the movie. So it sinks the audio to the -- -- watching and then on your tablet or your PC device you can watch like behind the scenes. Mock ups things like that. That are compared with the movie so take a dual screen experienced that at the Blu-ray second screen second blue or something like that it yachts you know referred to as the second screen but. It was there aren't many blu rays -- have done that in as one of what you guys know it's really it's cool to see that stuff happened to the takes a lot of working content. To be able to support a movie with all this extra stuff. And -- it's linked up with the audio not cool Lisa Adamo of that and and the of that second speeds in the trumping and of itself illegal act and it. You gotta know that we really well -- I be able to meet wanna sit there tablets one of those things -- you already know the movie so when you wanna watch it with the action info via. Instead of pay attention to the movie. It can be tough okay that was entered seconds. Our final email comes just from -- -- be well by its just a quick message -- you'll -- Monday this week was awful. -- now be able to was doomed I -- wait until Thursday also has a long time listener I appreciate your coverage of Apple -- -- making -- -- to even a keynote on. Even though -- could do this on his own of we couldn't we could of course can watch those. If it was not -- entertaining coverage of those events I would have not have appreciated how awesome US has level products is brought to us and all those accomplishments. Thanks to being -- -- cells it was assistant scratch her back you know -- yet. But it's from Russia to their -- such 500. All the way kisses back -- -- so now that we're back on this regular weekly schedule. We really do you wanna encourage you guys to continued its industry emails and calls I know it can be sometimes a little delayed. Because the timing of Russia now but we want Entergy keep on city and we still get -- -- and we just didn't get a claimant to lot of work only two weeks old. This time so yeah. But but definitely can become -- especially -- now if you're using the FaceBook for I had. What how many of you would go iPhone for us -- Andrew there's -- there are a lot of things to the a lot of questions that we -- that says keep it coming BL well -- cnet.com is our blog if you want am post comments there immediately after the episode that's a good place for timely discussion. Also our phone numbers -- 80616263. Which -- -- And -- -- like that I couldn't get that number eight during all that. Couldn't I know it's like an 80999980. What is that and other different. Now it's a statement -- -- -- buzz at cnet.com is our email address and island pretty theater. And we get. We'll see you next victory -- I know you guys are asking for computer love we'll we'll do it next week yet we promise instead of day on this so send -- your emails. Your love stuff will also look for some articles that might be relevant to this action definitely the idea is that computer being path. A day. Right we'll see guys -- man.