Speakeasy forum

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Unintended consequence of legalizing pot and gay marriage...

by MarkatNite / November 8, 2012 4:07 PM PST

...in some States: Liberals are gong to have to argue for States Rights, Full Faith and Credit, and narrow interpretation of the Commerce Clause.

Oh, and "hi, again" - Mark

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Hi Mark.Imagine if both hadbeen legalized in the same states
by Ziks511 / November 8, 2012 10:42 PM PST
Devil The potential for sex in the streets would be terrible.
Rob
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Wow, what a blast from the past! Hi Mark!
by Josh K / November 9, 2012 11:17 PM PST

The Fox morning show was hilarious the other day, one of the hosts worrying about people in Washington and Colorado driving while "all potted up." ROFL

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Hi, Josh!
by MarkatNite / November 11, 2012 10:49 AM PST

I'm impressed you watched FOX News. Although, I haven't watched Fox & Friends since they promoted Gretchen Carlson over Kiran Chetry. Which goes to show, even when you come over to the Conservative side, we still disagree. Happy The morning after the election, I was watching Soledad O'Brien who was the reason I started posting here back in 1996. Wow, can't believe it's been that long.

Getting back on topic, I seem to recall reading somewhere (don't remember where, unfortunately) that people who are drunk tend to drive more recklessly, whereas people who are stoned tend to drive more safely. Also, maybe this will lead to a change from Blood Alcohol Content to a Reaction Time test, which would seem to me to be more appropriate. (Shouldn't be too hard to do with the prevalence of tablets and video games.)

Mark(back)atNite

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Even legalized, I bet most employers
by Roger NC / November 10, 2012 12:16 AM PST

will still dismiss you based on random drug test showing the drug, just like if you test positive for alcohol at work.

Of course, alcohol tests only detect alcohol consumed in the last few hours. Pot will show up for days, or weeks if you used hair samples.

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Not to worry
by Steven Haninger / November 10, 2012 12:21 AM PST

Obamacare will pay for rehab...as many times as it's needed. Devil

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Obamacare?...NO?...YOU will
by JP Bill / November 10, 2012 12:30 AM PST
In reply to: Not to worry

Enjoy..... Devil

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OUCH!!!
by Steven Haninger / November 10, 2012 12:45 AM PST

Mitt! Help!

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I'd rather pay for rehab than throw them in
by Diana Forum moderator / November 10, 2012 2:20 AM PST
In reply to: Not to worry

jail for 20 years. Costs less.

Diana

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I'd agree, with reservations
by Roger NC / November 10, 2012 2:52 AM PST

at some point of recurring relapses, you have to face the fact some can't live without supervision and stay clean.

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How many rehab cycles would you allow
by Steven Haninger / November 10, 2012 3:39 AM PST

We see folks in and out for years who continue to relapse. There should be a limit...twice at the most, IMO.

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doesn't how long between lapses count for anything?
by Roger NC / November 10, 2012 3:59 AM PST

or life experience that may contribute?

I don't agree with unlimited cycles of rehap and as soon as they get out heading straight for the nearest fix either.

I recognize that any attempt to recognize individul differences invite misuse and abuse by some. I have no magic formula, but I just don't think every relapse is the same.

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I'm sure that, in the event of relapse,
by Steven Haninger / November 10, 2012 4:12 AM PST

some will blame the rehab program. I can agree that the amount of time between cycles could be a consideration but any policy should be designed to discourage a return to what's unacceptable forever and not just draw a line where one is free to return.

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I've wondered before if we should have
by Roger NC / November 10, 2012 4:18 AM PST

rehap/prisons just for drug users.

Complete incarceration with rehap for a set period of time, then work in the faciltiy itself with a bit more privacy, internet, personal hobbies, etc time. Moving on to work release or limited hour release with a return every night and testing.

Just a random thought, I'm not sure you could ever impliment anything like that.

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cold turkey
by James Denison / November 11, 2012 7:19 PM PST

is one of the best rehab approaches available. It's quick and none really want to go through it again.

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How many times have people tried to lose weight?
by Diana Forum moderator / November 11, 2012 9:02 AM PST

Should we say so many times and no more?

Diana

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are we talking about going through a fat rehab
by Roger NC / November 11, 2012 9:58 AM PST

program though?

I probably should be locked up somewhere on a restricted diet myself given the way they're portraying obesity as a national security problem in some instances.

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cut your calorie count to 1500 per day
by James Denison / November 11, 2012 7:22 PM PST

that's three meals of 500 calories per day. You feed off your fat when asleep and wake up refreshed in the morning. You can drop 2-4 pounds per week that way. Easier than exercising which just tires you out too quick and doesn't burn off that much anyway. My supper last night was a can of clam chowder, over a big can of mushrooms, 5 saltine crackers and a diet drink. Less than 500 calories and I was full.

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they'll do the same as drunks
by James Denison / November 11, 2012 7:17 PM PST

if they can't toss the habit or control it, they end up in the street on a park bench eventually.

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Marijuana is not addictive....
by Josh K / November 10, 2012 4:14 AM PST
In reply to: Not to worry

.....unless you have an addictive personality that can get you hooked on pretty much anything.

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Aren't there variables when we discuss addition?
by Steven Haninger / November 10, 2012 4:40 AM PST

We speak of clinical and psychological types. Clinical types would require a different treatment plan than psychological. The discussion of marijuana as being addictive is a long one. I've no personal experience other than having been in rooms where the atmosphere has been dense with it and around people who were under its affects. You're a proponent of legalizing it and I suspect your experience is quite different from mine. All I know is that I really don't care to be on the highway riding with or next to a vehicle with a driver who is stoned. Behavior modification might be a treatment for marijuana abuse. Something like an implant that detects the presence of the active chemical that triggers a 10000 volt shock might work. Happy

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are we back to additive vs habitual discussions?
by Roger NC / November 10, 2012 5:40 AM PST

I suspect regular marijuana use would be at least as hard to give up as smoking, and I can testify that tobacco isn't just something you take or leave it.

Even people that aren't in the genetic group that fall into alcoholism immediately upon starting to drinking become gradually dependent on alcohol. Knowing a few regular pot smokers in the past, I believe it's at least as habit forming as tobacco and alcohol.

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Much less difficult to "kick" than tobacco
by Josh K / November 10, 2012 7:25 AM PST

In fact I've known people who had less trouble detoxing from alcohol and heroin than tobacco.

I used to be a recreational pot smoker and when it came time for me to stop, I just stopped getting it. No withdrawals, no cravings, nothing.

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It's true
by Pepe7 / November 10, 2012 11:21 PM PST

Nicotine kicks the snot out of opiates when it comes to addictive substances. My friend's wife said the hardest thing to deal when she was (20 years) out of rehab was people constantly smoking, not seeing people drink or do other drugs. FWIW, marijuana doesn't even come close to being a dangerously addictive substance such as heroin or nicotine.

Luckily, some people have the psychological will and physical ability to quit smoking though. In my dad's case, he quit cold turkey, but gained nearly 75 lbs (in only three months) from all the nervous extra eating(!)

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(NT) again, consider the diffence in volume
by Roger NC / November 11, 2012 2:02 AM PST
In reply to: It's true
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Key there may be "recreational"
by Roger NC / November 11, 2012 2:01 AM PST

try smoking 20 to 40 joints a day like most cigarette smokers consume then see how easy it is to quit.

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That would be pretty impossible.....
by Josh K / November 11, 2012 7:43 AM PST

......unless you were a Rasta or something. That's a LOT of weed. Most people would likely fall asleep before they could smoke that much.

Quantities aren't the issue -- the amount of heroin someone typically ingests is very small, but if you do it for more than two or three days in a row, you can suffer withdrawal symptoms.

Ironic, isn't it, that two of the drugs most difficult to quit are legal (alcohol and tobacco). Alcohol withdrawal can be more dangerous than heroin withdrawal. The former can kill you without proper medical supervision; the latter will just leave you very sick for three days.

There are NO physical withdrawal symptoms from marijuana.

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just anecdotal I know
by Roger NC / November 11, 2012 10:03 AM PST

but the cases I've known that smoke pot everyday, even only a couple of joints, don't seem to wish to quit, no matter what.

It's not medically addictive maybe, but it's damn sure habit forming for many. I'll grant you it's a legitimate debate comparing it to alcohol on many points, but it's potential to ruin a life goes beyond nicotine IMO, unless the nicotine actually kills you.

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I did both in my youth
by James Denison / November 11, 2012 7:30 PM PST

and on a fairly regular basis, a couple years recreational for pot. Growing up in Florida it was easier tgo get than beer really. Quit in 1978 and never used again. I never felt addicted to it. Smoking however didn't end till 1985 when my first child was born. I tried to quit a few times, but needed more to provide the commitment I guess. The nicotine addiction is both physical and psychological I believe. I removed all smoking related material from my house so I'd not have a chance to give into temptation, started on a 4 day weekend. Those were the most difficult days, the ones after were more about missing the habit. As weeks turned to months, I actually began to dislike the smell of cigarettes others were smoking and I think that's when the addiction was fully broken.

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I agree
by James Denison / November 11, 2012 7:23 PM PST

I think most addictions are emotional more than anatomical.

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what happens then if...
by James Denison / November 11, 2012 7:16 PM PST

...they have the Olympics in a drug permitted zone. Will the Olympic officials be allowed still to test and disqualify for legal drugs?

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