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New PC Build to replace 7 year old system!

by bozobyte / February 12, 2014 1:14 PM PST

RETHINKING THIS REPLACEMENT PC~
To reiterate, again, I am not a gamer, nor do I Over Clock, but I DO use Pinnacle Studio 15 HD Ultimate, and Photoshop CS5 (3D), and I do not use these professionally, just for family and friends, and burn the output to MPEG2. So I am not looking to spend thousands of dollars, but I do need to replace my current system:
MSI P-35 Mobo,DDR2-8GB,Geforce 8600GT, 128 bit 512MB, 700w Thermaltake PSU, and Intel Q6600 2.4 Quad CPU. people are now telling me that the 700W PSU was an overkill from the beginning and now all I really need a 550W. I also have a 20" Viewsonic 1280x960, I have heard that I should replace this with an HD 24" ACER GD235HZ, 1280x1080, for video playback, but again, I am not a professional that really needs to see video color and output for clients, that I'll never have...so to save a little money now by keeping my present monitor.... maybe after the upgrade, maybe i will change it out.
Up until this morning, I was going to upgrade my 7 year old desktop with the following:
Z87-G43 LGA1150 Mobo / i5 4670K/ PC DDR3 1600 16 GB / 16GB DDR3 / GPU- Geforce GTX--650 / and keep my 700W..and hope for the best! ...
...But after talking to Micro Center, the guy tells me to get this instead:
GPU- R9260 AMD / ASUS X79 LGA 2011 Quad channel is faster than dual / 4th GEN. i7 4820K / Zalman 9000 CPU heatsink cooler, or Zalman CNPS9500A LED Universal CPU Cooler / Two SSD's, one 120GB for SCRATCH DISKS,, and the second for PRIMARY (APPS) and use my regular WD 500GB, and 2TB HD'S for storage / and Over Clock the Bios, not motherboard.
I also have my original CoolerMaster 690 case, and all the five internal case fans. he said that a 7 year old PSU may fail, so get a new one.
I never had a solid state drive, so I don't know what he meant by installing a SCRATCH DRIVE, and also a PRIMARY DRIVE, (don't think he meant to partition one SSD)
Video Files eat up a lot of hard drive space and Photoshop utilizes tons of scratch disc space, so maybe that's why he told me to get the two SSD's. Salesman techie dude also said that the scratch SSD only lasts a few years, maybe four or five, but the speed is what I gain.

He added, this system should last far longer than my seven year build. Plenty of room to upgrade in the future.
Would the AMD R900 series at almost $330.00, be better than the R700 series? maybe I can find it cheaper elsewhere.
Thank you for any suggestions, whether this seems like a solid build, or overkill?
Microcenter has the COMBO i7 4th,4820K, along with the Asus X79 2011 PRO both for $534.98.

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Upgrading System
by bozobyte / February 13, 2014 3:32 AM PST

Now that I realized the components the Micro center guy recommended includes a IVY BRIDGE 3 year old i7 4820K, compared to the newer 2013 i7 4770K ??? I have heard the HASWELL 4th Gen is the better CPU Model, than previous Sandy 2nd Gen., and the 3rd Gen Ivy Bridge. Wouldn't I rather have the newest, than older?

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Choices between i7 3rd G IVY 4820, and i7 4th G Haswell ?
by bozobyte / February 13, 2014 4:01 AM PST

I contacted ASUS today and asked about the 3rd gen IVY vs., 4th gen Haswell CPU's..

He said,
" The 4820K does allow for quad channel memory, which is faster FSB.
As does the P9X79 Pro:
8 x DIMM, Max. 64GB, DDR3 2400(O.C.)/2133(O.C.)/1866/1600/1333/1066 MHz Non-ECC, Un-buffered Memory
Quad Channel Memory Architecture
I would definitely go with the LGA 2011 (4820) if I had the choice.

Would I be limited using a 3rd gen CPU with any of my other hardware or software?

Upgrading to: i7, WIN7 PRO(64), 16GB DDR3 PC1600, a good GPU, like the AMD R9260.

Now I read that Intel is coning out with the 4th gen CPU's (e) Series...Can't win!

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What about GPU encoding?
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / February 13, 2014 4:04 AM PST

While you can get hung up on CPU nuances like I see above, there are some video editing suites that use the GPU instead. But let's be honest here, if we were just going to smash (video editing) video out we'd get a decked out Mac Pro.
Bob

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I think there are two things you need to look at.
by Oldartq / February 13, 2014 5:24 PM PST

1. Get the mobo you will need and compare price. 2. i7-4770k has built-in GPU which means you are +$150 already. It is true the 4820 has 4 channel memory but how important is it for you for what you do with the computer (I have no idea). Everything else are pretty equal. Have fun.

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New PC Build to replace 7 year old system!
by bozobyte / February 16, 2014 5:48 AM PST

Thank you all for chiming in with your suggestions.
I will re-read all replies and will take under advisement, Thanks!
How can I have a headache, if I have no brains????

Since it's been seven years since my last build, there are too many choices picking out the right MOBO/CPU/GPU Combo, in which I do not personally over-clock, or game, although most I've seen are mostly made for "GAMING", and have "OVER-CLOCKING" capabilities. So I guess whether I want it or not, I'll have to pick one, since I do not want to buy an already pre-loaded generic brand, nor can I afford a "CUSTOM", made to order PC. As long as I have HDMI, and PCIe-16x, Max. 32GB DDR3 (1600)

MSI suggested I go with the MSI Z87-MPOWER BOARD. (ASUS is especially known for building Gaming/OC Boards) Some have suggested the ASUS X79 PRO, and SABERTOOTH models, which for me, are way too much overkill. So, it's either the Mpower,or Z87-G43, or 45.

At this point, I want to save some money by simply getting the Haswell 4770, 3.4GHz, without the 'K', since I want to remain using the stock board speed. (Saved about $30.00+)

I don't fault the guy from Microcenter for trying to get me to buy more over the top components, to up his commission. he suggested this:
The ASUS P9x79 PRO 2011, at $270.00, (Was bundled at Microcenter with the i7 4820 Quad Channel $300.00. FOR $535.00)

I'm kicking around this, although I mind is not completely made up:
1) MOBO - ATX
MSI Z87-G45 with the 1150 LGA Socket (Dual Channel) $145.00 (MAX.32 GB)
(NOT SURE IF I CAN AFFORD THE QUAD CHANNEL, or stick with the DUAL.
2) CPU -
i7 4th G. 4770 3.4 Haswell (no 'K', no need overclocking) $280.00
3) MEMORY -
Crucial DDR3 XM53 (2x8GB) 16GB of 1600hz memory (Board max. is 32GB) $160.00
(Dual or Quad channel, don't know yet) (I don't think I need more than 32GB)
4) PSU-
Replace my 7 yr. old Thermaltake 700W PSU, with either the ANTEC VP550F G-
Series SSR-550 RM $60.00, OR... CM Coolermaster Elite V2 550W $60.00.
I have been told that 700W was way overkill, and I would simply need between a
500w-550w.
5) GPU-
MSI N650-MDI/OC GTX650 2GB ($130.00) OR
ASUS GTX650 Ti GDDR5 2GB ($162.00)
6) Keeping my CM Coolermaster 690 ATX case, since it's roomy enough and I installed five
additional fans. (fingers crossed, that the power button won't fail anytime soon)
7) CPU HEATSINK FAN -
Coolermaster EVO 212 Fry's $35.00/ Microcenter $30.00 OR
ZALMAN CNPS9500A LED Universal -Newegg - $40.00.
Cool Some type of Combo DVD/CD/BD Writer/Reader

9) HARD DRIVES - All this talk about the SSD'S, and their short-lived longevity?? You know how problematic, time consuming, and frustrating it is when you have to format/wipe an old or new drive, and spend hours RE-installing the O.S., Hardware, Programs/Applications, Update 64 Bit Drivers, .....Well, who wants to do this every few years, then only to replace the more expensive SSD's all over again. I think this time around, I'll buy a faster 250GB (10,000rpms) than the standard (72,000rpms) HHD to boot applications, and have it last longer, regardless of how speedy they seem to be. Besides, I have no problems with my present WD 74GB Raptor, other than now, even with no video content on it, just the bare programs, and the Win7 64 Bit O.S., now has a dangerously small 5.5GB left on this drive, so with Win7, I've tried deleting useless files, run disk cleaner, deleted unwanted programs that take up HD space to make more room, but, it's almost full anyway, so I will not do any more video editing until I change over to the new build.

Now that I will have the
(1) 250GB HDD, (BOOT) 10,000 rpms Load/Unload cycles ($90.00) Newegg
(2) 74GB Raptor HDD, (Storage) 72,000 rpms
(3) 2TB WD HDD, (Storage) 72,000 rpms
(4) 500GB HDD, (Storage) 72,000 rpms
TWO ADDITIONAL EXTERNAL HDDs (5) SEAGATE 3TB HDD, (6) WD 500GB HDD

With all of this, would I still need only a 500-550W PSU?
The consensus from others, is to either keep using the existing 700w, ( 7 year old Thermaltake) until it dies, or replace the PSU every time you do a rebuild. If I sell it, would anyone want it?
I thought with the GPU, the i7, and all the HDD's, I would need more power than 500W/550W. (ATX)

Whatever I upgrade with, will no doubt be a dramatic change from what I have now, from seven years ago. And since I am an video enthusiast that dabbles with Pinnacle Studio HD, and Photoshop CS5 with 3D, I would like to get a board that I may upgrade later on, with an CPU upgrade, and maybe more memory, but it is not a deal breaker if I get a board that does not.

And wouldn't you know it, The DDR4 is coming out soon.....I'm still using DDR2!

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Very similar to this build.
by R. Proffitt Forum moderator / February 16, 2014 6:07 AM PST
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This is what I'm thinking of buying for new build...
by bozobyte / February 18, 2014 11:43 AM PST

My Budget is about 700.00, or less. This is a skeleton list of potential parts, so I will take all of the previous suggestions to heart, nothing is concrete, just fine-tuning. I'm just going to go with the G41 on a LGA 1150 Socket, because anything is faster and better than my P35/Q6600 2.4/8GB DDR2.

Boy, did I ever get a lot of suggestions on which parts I would need for a new rebuild, according to your own personal experiences, but I have to decide and get down to it.
I thank you all! I'm not really out of the woods yet, getting these parts is one side of the coin, now I have to install and make it all work, flawlessly, I'm hoping!

Don't laugh, and since I am still somewhat of a newbie, this will be my 2nd build) So if there are any good tutorials on self building a computer, I welcome that, since it has been seven years and I may be rusty.

So I'll need to know exactly when to install the OS, Hard drive, (maybe boot drive first alone,) then install other storage HDD'S, then comes the MoBo Utilities, Software, Drivers, ETC., and so forth....I don't build everyday, so one little mistake can ruin everything.

To save money, I'm going to BUY these components:
(1) Z87-G41 & Intel i7 4770K (even though I do not overclock, or game) COMBO @ Micro center for $290.00.
(2) CPU Heatsink - Artic Freezer- $24.99 (newegg) OR Zalman CNP52X 80mm Aluminum and Copper heatsink, (copper for better cooling) for $28.99 (newegg)
(3) Crucial 120GB SSD for O.S. / Programs OR Samsung 256GB SSD for O.S. / Programs.
(4) Corsair/Kingston 8GB DDR3 (1600Hz) PC12800 (some say the 1866, not much different)

AND WILL BE KEEPING MY PRESENT DEVICES FOR NEW BUILD.....
(1) ATX CASE, Cooler Master cm690, (I'll need header for Front USB/eSata/Audio/Mic/headphone 3.5" Slot. (present case has old 2.0 USB's/esata/firewire)
(2) Use the onboard i7's IGP, for 4600 HD Video Editing, or if that doesn't work, maybe get 2GB GeForce GTX-650Ti GPU, but been told that this 4600 HD IGP, is as good as my old 8600GT GPU, I don't game, so it should not matter as much.
In fact, in a pinch, my Geforce 8600GT should also work with my G41, for the time being, since I do not play video games.
(3) And for internal storage, keeping my old WD74GB Raptor,10,000rpms, WD 2TB 72,000rpms, and WD500GB 72,000rpms.
(4) Use the Onboard Realtek HD Audio.

(5) Thermatake 700W ( It's six years old, and going strong, BUT.... if this old PSU is not certified to work on a LGA 1150 Board...Pins might not work, and not support Quad core CPU, then I'll have to replace.
I can't think of anything else at the moment, so I would imagine this will be sufficient.

Thanks!

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Questions before start my rebuild??
by bozobyte / February 19, 2014 8:09 AM PST

My last build was about 7 years ago.... I am old school when it comes to the newer than seven year ago technology, so forgive me with the following questions, since I have forgotten the protocol as to what to install in order, but first;

I am going to get the Samsung EVO 250GB SSD, does it come with SAT AIII 6.0 Gbps Cable, or do I buy separately?

If my CM690 CoolerMaster case has 5.75" width front bays, Do I also need somewhat of an adaptor 3.5-2.5' cage, or does it come with the SSD?

And also on the top of case, I have the old 2x2.0 USB, Firewire / eSata /headphone, microphone I/O's, ....and I get any mobo, whether it would be the B85, or Z87 chipset, I probably can not hook up the Mobo wires to these old top inputs, so I would have to buy a Front Multi-Port USB 3.0,SD Card reader, to hook up to the mobo, and still be able to hook up the top Audio, Microphone I/O also to the mobo?

After Install of SSD, OS, Etc., I would also beforehand, PRE-download, and save on Flash drive, all the necessary 64 bit Drivers? What type of files?
MSI Utilities, AC Realtek chipset, Samsung EVO 250GB drivers? Are these right? When I'm setting this up, I will not have any backup computer, so I don't want to be DEAD in the water. I know all the other hardware updates will be installed after I get back online, I'm just worried about what I need to know BEFORE wiping the HDD, and Installing the New drive.

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Questions before start my rebuild??
by bozobyte / February 19, 2014 9:24 AM PST

I just called MSI to see if they include a large top-view color schematic of the board, like I got with my last MSI P-35 motherboard, he told me no.
I guess I'll have to revert to looking at the "ZOOM" feature on the product itself.

I also asked him if I keep my CM Coolermaster ATX case, with the old 2.0 UBS,Microphone,Audio,Firewire,eSata on top of the case, could i plug in only the microphone.Audio onto the MOBO, and buy a Multi-Port 2/4x3.0 USB, SD Reader for the front bay, and plug THOSE into the MObo, ...he told me with the 3.0 USB, I will need to buy an all new case...really? if nothing else, if I keep this case, I will have to use the rear USB, for card reader, and all other USB devices. This reminds me of another question...Can I use the new 3.0 USB with my older All in One Epson NX300 Printer? is that where the new updated drivers come in from Epson?
Thanks!

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Here, use this link.
by Oldartq / February 20, 2014 1:46 AM PST
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Did they tell you the reason why...
by Oldartq / February 20, 2014 2:24 AM PST

you can't use the front bay? I am really puzzle.

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Questions before start my rebuild??
by bozobyte / February 19, 2014 9:26 AM PST

I just called MSI to see if they include a large top-view color schematic of the board, like I got with my last MSI P-35 motherboard, he told me no.
I guess I'll have to revert to looking at the "ZOOM" feature on the product itself.

I also asked him if I keep my CM Coolermaster ATX case, with the old 2.0 UBS,Microphone,Audio,Firewire,eSata on top of the case, could i plug in only the microphone.Audio onto the MOBO, and buy a Multi-Port 2/4x3.0 USB, SD Reader for the front bay, and plug THOSE into the MObo, ...he told me with the 3.0 USB, I will need to buy an all new case...really? if nothing else, if I keep this case, I will have to use the rear USB, for card reader, and all other USB devices. This reminds me of another question...Can I use the new 3.0 USB with my older All in One Epson NX300 Printer? is that where the new updated drivers come in from Epson?
Thanks!

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According to Amazon,
by Oldartq / February 20, 2014 1:38 AM PST
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In the old day when mobo still support floppy,
by Oldartq / February 20, 2014 1:17 AM PST

I just install the floppy drive and RAM and video card then fire it up with DOS. That's would tell me if the build is working or not with minimum components. I am not sure now. I am thinking maybe cd/dvd drive with a "live linux cd/dvd"? Just a thought.

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Will old MSI P-35 Audio onboard AC'97 work with MSI B85-G41?
by bozobyte / February 22, 2014 10:36 AM PST

Will old MSI P-35 Audio onboard AC'97 work with MSI B85-G41?

Another thing about me using my old 7 year old CoolerMaster 690 ATX case, is that it presently has the 2.2.0 USB, Audio/Mic, eSata, and firewire on top of the case. The Audio for this old Mobo (MSI P-35 Platinum 7345) originally came with AC'97 on the board.

If I get the MSI B85-G41 MoBo, it comes with both 2.0 USB (Front and back) and 3.0 USB (front and back) as well as the Audio/Mic, So hopefully, I can hook up the old 2.0 USB Top connector to the onboard header, but will I still be able to use that top Audio/Mic and 2.0 USB's? Silly me, I thought I would have to go out and buy a newer case because of this.

Some folks say I would have to buy a Silverlake FP32B-E Bay connector to hook up Audio/Mic/2.0-3.0 USB. others tell me I could hook them right up to the board.

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Ok, here is what I have learned.
by Oldartq / February 22, 2014 1:51 PM PST

The connector on the usb2 has 4 wires plus a shield where as the usb3 has 9 wires plus a shield. So I am guessing you can't use the old connector, at least not as usb3. Take a look at how it's assemble, if it's simple, maybe you can just change it. Yeah..improvisation. Have fun.

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3.0 USB device into a 2.0 USB on front connector?
by bozobyte / February 23, 2014 6:59 AM PST

The thing with using existing 2.0 front connectors is if I plug a 3.0 USB Ext. HDD into it, the speed transfer won't be as fast, but can still use 3.0 device in a 2.0 USB connector? if so, I'm making way too much out of this.

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USB 3 drives have always worked for me w/USB 2 ports
by wpgwpg / February 23, 2014 7:09 AM PST

I've got USB 3 hard drives and flash drives that work fine with USB 2 ports. Getting them to work with USB 2 ports has been easy for me, getting them to work with the USB 3 ones was more of a challenge. Wink

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List of new build parts
by bozobyte / February 23, 2014 6:55 AM PST

I also have heard MANY MANY suggestions from people about what's good, and what's trash, but I think I narrowed it down to these...otherwise, I'll never finish picking out parts, and if I do not soon, then the DDR3 memory will then be DDR8.

Mobo - MSI B85-G41 PC_Mate ATX 1150 $ 70.00 (Newegg)
PSU - Seasonic Gold Certified 550W $ 75.00 (Newegg)
CPU Cooler - CM Hyper 212 EVO $ 35.00 (Fry's)
SSD - Samsung EVO MLC 550GB $ 157.00 (Newegg)
CPU - 4th Gen. i7 4770 3.4 GHz LGA 1150 $ 240.00 (Micro center)
.....Fry's replaced this with an i7 4771
4th gen. $318.00 (Frys)
RAM - Corsair XMS 2x8GB DDR3 1600 $ 170.00 (Fry's)

Thank you!

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? Installing PSW, and RAM on NU MSI B85-G41
by bozobyte / February 25, 2014 7:44 AM PST

? Installing PSW, and RAM on NU MSI B85-G41


Hello,
I have posted many posts about suggestive parts for my new build computer, and have graciously received many replies, and thank you! Now, I have all my parts, and need some clarification on the step-by-step process. And yes, I have turned to Newegg and Youtube videos for tutorials on "how to build a PC from scratch", but it seems there are many differences from one video to the next.

It has been seven years since I built my last MSI P-35 Platinum 775, and after reading most of these part instructions for this build so far, seems to have way more warnings and processes to follow, than my last time...knock on non-conductive wood, but I guess I did something right the last time, because this present computer is running top shape, other than the 7 year old intel Q6600 2.4, the 8GB DDR2, a 7 year old Thermaltake toughpower 700w...but I need to upgrade.

SSD: Samsung 250GB SSD

PSU:
To clear this all up, Does it matter exactly when I should install the PSU...anytime, or after everything is ready to be powered up? Because of the STATIC ISSUE, I DO I have an ANTI-STATIC Wrist band. Some say to install the PSU first, then don't plug the computer's power to on, another site, said to install the PSU with temp ground install screws, then when done, replace the regular install screws in. ( I bought a Seasonic S12G Gold Plus-80 550W ) I don't know if the factory PSU has any electric charge that can ruin any components.

I was going to install EVERYTHING FIRST, then INSTALL the Power Supply LAST....is this WRONG?

CPU FAN:
I have a Coolermaster HYPER212 CPU HeatSink, and I will install the underside Mounting bracket, should i do this FIRST, then install CPU,then attach the Cooler on top of the CPU, then continue with the build?

RAM:
According the MSI manual, I am to place each of the DDR3 8GB Ram ( I only have two ) in DIMM #2, and DIMM #4 BLACK, but on another site, it said to install in DIMM #1, then 3, BLUE, or else the computer won't boot.

If anyone knows of a "Step by Step" new PC Desktop instructional Video, or text, please let me know.

If there are any other precautions on setting up this board, like any changes in the Bios, also let me know.
Thank you for everything?

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Use your logic and bet...
by Oldartq / February 25, 2014 12:13 PM PST

you will be fine. My grandson just built his first computer last week. my only advice to him was to install the RAM and the CPU first before mounting the mobo to the chassis, that way there's little bit more elbow room to work in. He was so happy because it worked when he booted it up. yeah I think computer are built the same way now as it was 7 years ago. So good luck and enjoy.

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...Still need a GPU with an INTEL i7 4770?
by bozobyte / March 1, 2014 5:13 PM PST

Hello,
I'll be out of all of your hair soon, and wont be a bother any longer, but...OK, I got the parts for the rebuild, so I am not yet convinced I need a Nvidia GPU.
CPU - intel i7 4770 3.4GHz
MEMORY - Crucial Ballistix 2x 8GB DDR3 (PC3-12800) 1600
MoBo - MSI B85-G41 PC Mate (LGA 1050)
PSU - Seasonic 550w S12G Gold
CPU Heatsink - CoolerMaster Hyper 212EVO
Boot SSD - Samsung 840EVO 250GB

On my last 7 year old build, I installed a 700W, and it turns out people are telling me that's an overkill, so this around I decided on only a 550w, so as long as I don't do a SLI double Hi-End GPU's, I hope this will he sufficient enough.
I've heard from others that because the i7 Haswell CPU has the built in HD Graphics, I may not actually need a GPS, but someone mentioned having a card, like the GTX-650 Ti for instance, would be an improvement for watching YouTube and Video editing.
Will I be at a loss if I don't get a GPU to supplement this build? I could afford one, but not the more expensive,upper level gaming GPU.
I guess I could always try it first with Pinnacle, then decide, and install it later, but again, while I'm putting this all in now, it would be easier, and faster.
Thank you!

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.Still need a GPU with an INTEL i7 4770?
by bozobyte / March 2, 2014 3:15 AM PST

Thanks All!
From all the different suggestions on whether to get a GPU, or stick with the i7 HD 4600, it gets a little confusing, and the bottom line, which most everyone can agree on, is for video editing, the two most important components are the CPU, and the onboard RAM memory, and not so much the GPU, which now is very necessary for gaming.

I wanted a type of media PC, but concentrating primarily on the JPG'S, MPG2,4, AVI, MOV, MP3's, Photo & Video editing", and streaming, AND NOT for gaming or overclocking.

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Here's the thing,
by Oldartq / March 2, 2014 10:18 AM PST

That card will still be there when you wanted/needed it. Why worry about it, just do without and see how you like it. You might think the 4600 doing just fine. Like I said, you can always add it in later.

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