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BOL broken, lets fix it

by Arborond / September 7, 2007 / 12:20 PM UTC

Like all of you, BOL used to be my favorite but now it's busted. Rather then getting informed listening I am just getting frustrated or irritated. I was going to unsubscribe today but first I thought perhaps we can fix it instead.
How about some suggestions! (that suggestions not criticism) Please let's skip the fire Molly/Molly is awesome debate. And the don't talk about X company it's a waste of time, news is news.
What do you guys think?

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Put in a topic timer
by IceBurgh / September 7, 2007 / 12:36 PM UTC

How about a timer, like Pardon the Interruption, that rings at an interval and then they move to the next topic.

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not a bad idea
by Arborond / September 7, 2007 / 12:44 PM UTC
In reply to: Put in a topic timer

perhaps even a formula like: Importance of the story X Interest in the topic
like Interest factor would be higher for a cool new technology then say DRM

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probably taking a break...
by shawnlin / September 7, 2007 / 12:42 PM UTC

I don't think BOL or the BOL forum is busted.
I don't appreciate all the negative-energy/anger (from listeners, the BOL hosts, or otherwise) either. Constructive criticism is always preferred and respect for everyone's opinion should be a standard, in my opinion.

News of fantastic or horrible products or services are of interest, but jumping *all over* a company for an isolated case, one-time event, or similar incident is, in my opinion, demanding more than what can be sustainable. It'll depend on your tolerance whether you consider what Apple did as a one-time event or part of their behavior - anytime something gets really popular, criticism goes up as well (consider Google of 5yrs ago and now...the same could happen with Linux).
I don't think Apple did the right thing to drop the price this soon - maybe in October/November would have been fine, also giving more reasoning as to *why* the price drop happened would also lower my ire at the company.

Well, I don't want to add any more negative stuff to the forum or the community so I think I'll take break from the forums and podcast for a few days - as the ancient, tried and true saying goes,"...And this too, shall pass."

Have a wonderful weekend - all of you,
Shalin

p.s. Arborond, sorry if this deflates your energy about "fixing BOL" go forth and fix away if you'd like. I'd just like to caution you about knowing what it's like when it *works right* in the first place and then fixing only what's not working - ya know? Have fun, honest! :o)

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I agree
by zanzoodle / September 7, 2007 / 12:54 PM UTC

I'm having a very hard time listeneing to BOL. It use to be the best podcast on the internet. The downgrade of is due to the loss of Veronica and Molly has turned into a major opinionated Apple hater.

The problem is that Apple is a RED HOT company right now and Molly is an Apple hater. Quite honestly Molly is much better used when she is talking about tech and not going on and on with her rants, it's boring.

Did you hear the Friday Pod Cast 9/7. I thought she was going to run out of the room crying.

The loss of Veronica was major to CNET.

dean
www.zanzoodle.com

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C'mon BOL...Objectivity Needs To Step In Sometime!
by wncmacs / September 7, 2007 / 9:27 PM UTC
In reply to: I agree

I too am disappointed with the decline of BOL since Veronica's departure and Molly's return. It seems the show now is all about opinion and little on news. I understand that it isn't a "hard" news show, but the ranting and opining has gone overboard, and in my opinion Molly is to blame.

First, a disclaimer. I own Macs and I prefer them over WIndows products. However, I am objective about things. I didn't buy an iPhone because I felt it was too expensive. I'm also using a 4 year old PowerBook because I'm waiting for the new models to have something revolutionary, not evolutionary as the initial Intel MacBook Pros have been. The point is I don't jump when Steve says to. I make my own mind up when to buy something, and it has to be worth its price to get me to spend the money.

Kudos to Tom for pointing out that you *DON'T* have to buy a product if you think it isn't worth the money. However, Molly, you want to crucify the company when the consumers are the ones who make the decision on whether to pull the trigger on a purchase. No, Apple was wrong to drop the price this early in the game so drastically, but there are economic forces at play in this issue (the new iPod Touch for example) that kind of forced their hand. They *HAD* to introduce the new iPod (remember Ms. Wood, you've been berating Apple for their boring iPod line, saying that it needed a shake-up) and it *HAD* to be done before Christmas. So, to keep the iPhone relevant, the price drop had to happen, plus Nokia's N95 is entering the market and Apple had to meet that competition head on. One other point, BOL has been discussing the NAND flash memory shortage that has been developing after a fire in a Samsung plant earlier this year. Molly's initial reaction and review of the iPod Touch was where's the 32 Gb model? Well, if you had been keeping up with this important story Molly, you would know that Apple has 25% of the ENTIRE flash memory production bottled up, and with the constraints from the fire and other forces in the flash memory production processes, I think they've done pretty good getting a 16Gb iPod out the door, not to mention that the 32 Gb flash memory is prohibitively expensive now.

Well, that's off my chest, now on to fixing BOL. I come from a broadcasting background and in j-school, I was taught that my main job is to be objective and not let my personal feelings get in the way of a story. Molly lets this happen all of the time. Yes, it seems as if Apple is her whipping boy, but she also shows too much opinion on other important issues too. I think opinion is fine, but it needs to be cut back on this show. It seems as if 90% of BOL is rants and opinion now, and that isn't serving the audience well. It's your job BOLers to make your audience aware of the issues of the day and LET THEM DECIDE based on FACTS what their opinion on the subject should be. That's what good journalism SHOULD be and God knows we have so little of that anymore in the mainstream press where it's all about spin. So, cut back on the opinions, especially Molly.

Second, a third host is needed a la Veronica. Yes, she was an Apple fan girl, but she did a good job keeping things in perspective and entertaining on the show. If you're gonna let Molly go off as a loose cannon, then have someone on there to try and keep the thing reeled in like Veronica used to do.

Third, have guests on the show to bring in other viewpoints. You have done this in the past, but they are few and far between. It's much more interesting if you can have a guest who is involved with the main story.

One of my biggest criticiams of CNet in general is how they eschew the live interview with the newsmaker and let the journalist deliver his/her interpretation of what the newsmaker has been saying. I feel that does a dis-service to the audience by both introducing bias into the reporting (see the opinion rant above) plus makes me feel as if they can't trust me to listen to Larry Ellison or Linus Torvalds or whomever is in question. This is radio/TV CNet, not a newspaper. Radio/TV has recorded audio and video for stories. You need to step up and deliver that style of content, instead of having your "journalists" tell us what they feel is important.

I unsubscribed to MP3 Insider after Veronica left because Jasmine is so anti-iPod it isn't funny. She is just all the time trying to find something to stick the players with so she can hype others that she stretches the criticisms beyond the point of sensibility. Again, I'm fine with CONSTRUCTIVE criticism about a product, but MP3 Insider hasn't had an objective opinion on the iPod in a long time. Molly does much of the same in her presentations on CNet, and if BOL doesn't lose some attitude, then they will lose another listener in me.

I just hate to see this show denigrate into what it has become. I used to look forward to listening to it daily. Now, I just dread to hear Molly rant. Please BOL, do something!

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Just Caught and...Wow
by digital_ron / September 10, 2007 / 6:16 PM UTC

What in the world is going on. Where is this apple hating come from? Is Steve Jobs the devil now. Molly has come back with some venom. I could make many comments, but I won't. I will just say Molly get some sleep cause the baby is making you cranky,

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The loss of Veronica is fine with me
by tashman / September 8, 2007 / 7:18 AM UTC
In reply to: I agree

I don't think the recent problems with the cast have anything to do with veronica being gone. I never thought she added much at all. She either chimmed in with the completely obvious or chimmed in with complete nonsense and uninformed thoughts. Personally I'm glad she is gone, I wish her well but I didn't enjoy listening to her.

That said I do think having a third personality would help. Maybe they are slowing working Jason into the mix.

tim

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Long Time Listener
by echeola / September 7, 2007 / 1:08 PM UTC

I was so happy with BOL and always looked forward to it, until recently. After the departure of Veronica I noticed that the tone of the show has become more and more critical of Apple. It makes sense, Apple is #1 in many categories. 1 in five laptops sold is a Mac (just wait until we get the new OS bump)! iPods are rocking. The iPhone is the #1 selling smartphone. Customer satisfaction with Apple has been great.

That's the cost of being a big target.

It's reasonable to criticize Apple, but Molly's rant and her defense of the rant are so vitriolic, unmatched by any other of her rants. I truly don't understand it. I mean even net neutrality, hideous DRM, or stupid uninformed government officials regulating the internet has not elicited this type of response. It seems unbalanced and unfair. Really, this price drop is worse than these?

So whatever, Molly's not Dvorak and this will not help her like it helped him. Even Dvorak never took it this personally.

I really don't want to listen to this type of hysterics and have been thinking of dropping the podcast for a while. Next week may be my last.

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If you want to hear praise of Apple
by irafreight / September 7, 2007 / 1:27 PM UTC
In reply to: Long Time Listener

I suggest you go listen to MacBreak Weekly or ApplePhone Show or TWIT or follow Kevin Rose around all day.

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lets focus on constructive suggestions
by Arborond / September 7, 2007 / 1:39 PM UTC

listening to a different podcast doesn't fix this one.
We can't banish Molly, we can't banish Apple there must be another solution.
How can we remove the frustration and put back the informative fun.

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I don't see any problems with the podcast.
by irafreight / September 7, 2007 / 2:10 PM UTC

For those who do, there are plenty of other podcasts out there. This can't be the only one you listen to, I listen to over a hundred per week. It's my substitute for talk radio.

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Right
by Arborond / September 7, 2007 / 2:57 PM UTC

If I want Apple news there are other things to listen to. What made BOL great is that you could get all the news and opinion in a format that was fun. Endless tirades on why Apple is evil is about as boring as a podcast about how Apple is wonderful in every way.

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To be fair
by Lisa J. / September 7, 2007 / 3:00 PM UTC

There are many podcasts out there that just don't cut it. BOL has always made me laugh out loud, and there's nothing wrong with giving suggestions to make it cooler.

If I just wanted to listen to news, yes there are many podcasts out there that'll do it. But BOL is special.

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TWIT has the right balance usually
by Nicholas Buenk / September 7, 2007 / 2:50 PM UTC

Critical of apple when necessary. Not bashing apple at every opportunity. Wink

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TWIT network
by ulric2 / September 8, 2007 / 10:16 AM UTC

IMHO the TWIT podcast have a Pro-Apple balance, which may suite you. It's all pro Mac and Apple, even on "Windows Weekly" they talk about Apple and the Mac. They're all mac fans, so they won't criticize unless something is really egregious and the general feeling in the Mac community.

Scott Bourne on the MacBreak two weeks ago even argued that hacking the iPhone was 'immoral'! It takes an extremist to make the rest look more center..

Most of the guys on TWIT mainly use Macintosh and in some case only use Apple software. To counterpoint, they talk about the irrelevant Zune, instead of the tons of devices from Sandisk, Samsung, Archos, because they don't know them. They're all into the Apple Lifestyle. Of course it doesn't lead to serious criticism when you only have anecdotal (or cartoonish!) knowledge of non-apple things.
TWIT was even feature on an ad on Apple.com

p.s.: Leo runs Windows on OS X through Parallel Desktop and owns about 20 iPods, the Apple TV, the iPhone, etc. That's how 'normal' and balanced these guys are.. they're not seeing things from the point of view of normal people who aren't that into Apple.

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I disagree
by Nicholas Buenk / September 9, 2007 / 1:23 AM UTC
In reply to: TWIT network

They aren't necessarily pro-apple. They're just mac users.
The twit podcast is not fulled with apple praising or apple bashing. They're interested in the tech. Not the fight.
That's how I see the show anyway.

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Yes
by Arborond / September 9, 2007 / 2:27 PM UTC
In reply to: I disagree

you make a very good point. I love TWIT but enjoyed BOLs faster moving (shorter) format back when BOL was fun and informative. Now it kinda fells like standing by while an irate, unreasonable customer bullies a poor shop clerk who has no recourse but to sit and take it and has no power to do anything about the original problem.

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(NT) who has no recourse??
by irafreight / September 9, 2007 / 2:57 PM UTC
In reply to: Yes
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Maybe you didn't understand
by echeola / September 10, 2007 / 7:08 AM UTC

I said that it was ok to criticize Apple, just don't get hysterical.

You know PBS not Randy Rhodes.

or if you're a Fox fan.

Chris Wallace not Bill O'Reily.

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Funny Rants
by Lisa J. / September 7, 2007 / 2:14 PM UTC

I have a suggestion: Have the rants be funny again. I will forever remember Tom's rant about Amazon's Unbox. That was one of the funniest rants in the history of rants. Molly's got a few as well on the funny front.

Lately, the rants have been uncomfortable, so just keep em light and funny, and you won't have some listeners uncomfortable as well. Happy

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Good point
by Arborond / September 7, 2007 / 2:18 PM UTC
In reply to: Funny Rants

I wonder if it would help to include a new host who is "outside the (tech) beltway" Someone who could better judge what the average geek cares about and know how passionate to get relative to the interest level.
Comments?

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Jason
by Lisa J. / September 7, 2007 / 2:22 PM UTC
In reply to: Good point

Have Jason speak more. Problem solved Happy

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Balance to the force
by Arborond / September 7, 2007 / 2:28 PM UTC
In reply to: Jason

Would Jason in fact restore balance to the BOL force?
What say ye?

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don't give Jason any ideas...
by ibcrandy-2120454356981420 / September 7, 2007 / 3:59 PM UTC
In reply to: Balance to the force

or he'll demand that he's referred to on the show as "The Chosen One" Happy

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Have the rants be funny again
by ulric2 / September 8, 2007 / 10:21 AM UTC
In reply to: Funny Rants

good idea! After all, what's the point of trying to counter-point vof example the Apple Appologists or fanboys? It's not going to convince anyone. You have to bring new facts, or have some funny spin about it. Otherwise you're repeating yourself and you can't win.

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How about............
by SwampYankee01 / September 7, 2007 / 2:17 PM UTC

Buzzout loud...Except for Macs & Apple
The religious nuts could go find another podcast and we could have BOL back

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thought of that but
by Arborond / September 7, 2007 / 2:20 PM UTC
In reply to: How about............

The trouble is Apple is often important/influential in the tech landscape. If they don't cover Apple there will be a big hole in the coverage. I agree it might boost the fun factor though.

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Apple important maybe
by tashman / September 8, 2007 / 7:27 AM UTC
In reply to: thought of that but

I'm not sure why apple is considered so important to the average person. They are great for advertisers, great for making news but there products are overpriced and unmoving. I just don't see it. Every one of their products locks you into their little world, then everyone ******* about that. Don't buy the products period.

So I think BOL could live without the daily apple update. Sure if something big comes along cover it but get real. Not just BOL but every show seems to cover apple events like this.

* some rumor - lets talk about it

* rumor changed - talk some more

* apple might talk - lets talk some more

* apple gives sneak peak - oh, lets talk some more

* 27 million people give their opinion of the upcoming apple announcement, leaks and 47 different things that might happen based on the 4 best rumors. - lets talk some more.

* Apple announcement - Ok, we can talk about this

* 3 more days of talking about the apple announcement, who was right who was wrong....

* Oops another apple rumor - proceed to step one.

Please please make this stop

tim

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So sayeth another mac-hater...
by payshunz / September 9, 2007 / 10:00 AM UTC
In reply to: Apple important maybe

With such an uninformed, biased opinion about Apple, I unfortunately found it quite difficult to read the rest of your post. Nevertheless I suffered through.

You are no more tied in to Apple once you buy a Mac then you are tied in to Microsoft when you buy any of the thousands of variants of PCs that ALL run on their Windoze OS.

As for overpriced, you get what you pay for, and the Mac OS makes the extra cost of the machine well worth it. Windows XP has only caused me frustration and woe, and i marvel at how Windows users (apparently yourself included) either don't realize how bad an OS it is or are so used to the crappy way it runs that you don't seem to know any better and obliviously put up with it.

I agree with earlier comments about having Molly tone down her Mac-hating tirades and having BOL try to include fewer Apple articles (as too many such articles cause too much bitching and moaning by the Mac-hating masses). A third speaker would also be a good idea, as even though Tom has a nice way of toning down Molly's anti-Apple rants, these rants still leave the listeners with a 'bad taste in the mouth' (or perhaps a harsh tone in the ear?).

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Life's short
by irafreight / September 9, 2007 / 11:01 AM UTC
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